By way of asking my question, let me pose a simple hypothetical that demonstrates reality creation, as I understand it from various explanations on this board.

The bumblebee cannot possibly fly. Have you heard this before? The bumblebee defies the laws of physics. The laws of physics state that a bumblebee's wings are too small in relation to the bumblebee's body size for it to be able to fly.

If physics says that the bumblebee cannot fly, then there must be some "supernatural" force at work. The bumblebee must not know it cannot fly, but rather it believes that it can fly, and therefore it can fly. It is a perfectly sensible solution.

Except that it is wrong.

It turns out that there are some bumblebees physics we didn't know about. Each beat of the bumblebee's wings produces a small vortex above them (like a little twister) that greatly increases the wings' lift.

This fact is not something that exists because a scientist decided to believe it. This fact of bumblebees has always existed, waiting to be discovered. The discovery of this fact brought it out of the realm of superstition, and into the light of rational science.

Do humans do the same thing with reality creation? Do they see what they want to see, all evidence to the contrary?

asked 11 Nov '09, 05:53

Vesuvius's gravatar image


edited 11 Nov '09, 06:01

This fact is not something that exists because a scientist decided to believe it.

I would disagree with this statement.

At some level, we have all agreed on the rules that this physical platform operates from. This gives us the stability to explore and interact with the rules of this physical experience. Non-physical lacks this stability of focus, hence the need to incarnate.

This is why you don't see people flying around like Superman or walking through walls. It's not that it's not possible, it's just that from our broader perspective of experiencing this communal reality, we have chosen to agree that this is beyond the scope of this particular experiment. If you had the desire and were to make the effort to make those non-standard beliefs dominant within yourself, then they would have no choice but to manifest.

So your definitive statements about what can and can't be done are only expressions of those things that you have come to accept as being the rules of this reality at some level, perhaps beyond your conscious awareness.

If you were, as your question says, to really see what you wanted to see despite all evidence to the contrary, it would become true for you regardless of what anyone else says can and can't be done.


answered 11 Nov '09, 07:58

Stingray's gravatar image


edited 11 Nov '09, 08:04

You make some interesting points. Like Shroedinger's cat, an idea does not exist until you observe it. I can go with that. The broader question is, does it matter? I say the rules are fixed. You say the rules are fixed because we have chosen to believe they are fixed. What's the difference? If I choose to believe that the bumblebee flies because of supernatural powers, I can certainly choose to believe that, but it will NOT square with what other people observe about the nature of that reality. It will certainly be true in my own inner world, but choosing that world means that I must...

(11 Nov '09, 08:24) Vesuvius

..leave this one behind, since I can no longer agree to its rules. +1.

(11 Nov '09, 08:31) Vesuvius

Refering to your bumblebee analogy... Bumblebees don't only know that they can fly, but they have the resources(WINGS) to fly. Regardless of whether their wings are small, or the beat speed of it's wings per second is low. With human beings it's almost the same... If for example you want to be a aeroplane pilot, you first have to get the resources(LICENCE TO FLY A PLANE). If you believe in your "dream", you will eventually get the job. My point is the "CREATOR" didn't give a bumblebee wings to walk. The same applies to our minds/brains. Let's use them.:)


answered 12 Nov '09, 08:33

Chosen-one's gravatar image


I'm not sure I get your point.

(12 Nov '09, 15:40) Vesuvius

First of all, their si no RIGHT ir WRONG. Their is only CHOICE. What you CHOOSE as your experience you will have it. Simple as that. Period.

So why is their so much pain nad violence in the world? Becuse we chose the wrong beliefs. We have reinforced by millenias the value of HAVING instead if BEING that we have become so much disconnected from the source, that the only way for us to compensate for that is to destroy ourselves. The way we do it depends on the individual: drugs, alcohol, overeating, mortal dis-eases.

Feelings of fear are the most valuable clue that our beliefs are out of tune with our core. Why? Because beliefs are ALL around us. Our parents teach us, our friends, spouses, children, TV, radio, internet. Since we are babies subconcoiusly we are being "fed" belief systems of our parents. They maybe diffrent beliefs: not having enough, being unworthy etc. In "normal" societies when children acquire a certain age they have the time to check their belief systems and assest which work for them or not. In out society it's in the teenagers time. That's why they are so rebelling. They don't rebel their parents but the belief systems they represent. If the parents are concoius of that and willing, they let the kid play out what he wants and CHOOSE which belief systems wrk for him and which don't. But most don't. They assume that the ONLY way is their way and that if you don't comply a punishment is at stake. It can mean anything: choosing a carrier, sexual endevors. Anything that the parents don't approve as their view of the world. It's not their fault because they have been given them by their parents, and they by theirs and so on.

So if you see a young person in his early twenties that has shrugged shoulders, is afraid to speak his mind, has all kinds of fobias you can be pretty sure that in that case the parents belief systems won. They didn't let him choose what he wanted to be, so now, on the deeper level his miserable, because the world he seas isn;t the one he would like to see.

On the other hand if you see a person who is aggresive, going all the way ahaed with anything he wants, not looking back at anyone, you can say he had a time of fight over his belief systems. He didn't comform his parents beliefs and has been in a fight with them. He has prevailed. But the sad thing is that now he learned that he has to fight for everything, especiall with his parents. Now any advice they give him, maybe even for the better, he might automaticly dismiss out of fear of agreeing with them on any level.

So the helathiest is to make the kids do what they want, giving them all the advice you can, but NEVER inflicting them with your RIGHTOUSNESS and UNMISTEAKABLITY. You can make eithrt your kid miserable for life or make an enemy for life. Choice is yours.

So, now that you know that you have beliefs that don;t beong to you, how do you change them? Simple, firt you must identify a belief. Of course we want to change beliefs that no longer serve us, so our examination may start in a situation that we feel, discomfort, when we are not realxed or at peace. Those are guidelines that tell us that those belief systems are out of tune with uor ntural self.

So once you got the feeling you assest the situation and ask:"Why do I feel that way? What belief would I have to have to react the way I do now?" After exploring and finding out the belief is GONE! By identifing it you send it on it's way, automaticly. It's only been their to serve you, and since you got it's "point" it's no longer useful. So how do you change it. Simple. You just CHOOSE what it will be. Say "Next time in this situation I wanna feel this and this and react that nad that way" THat's it. It's that simple. You changed it. Now to lock it in next time that thing happens you ACT as if the new belief is in place. When that happens you have changed completely. It's that simple.


answered 11 Nov '09, 17:25

wildlife's gravatar image


You model of behavior for parents leaves out one little detail: the safety of their children. I think most parents would tell you that, by keeping their children safe (ie. by imposing restrictions on their behavior), they are providing the child the freedom to learn, grow, and experience the world without having to worry about the child injuring or killing themselves. Most parents would agree that this is a good thing.

(11 Nov '09, 18:56) Vesuvius

You may dislike some of your parents' righteousness, but the fact that you are here having this discussion with me speaks volumes about your parent's instincts. Judging from your writings, you apparently turned out to be a good person, so they must have done something right. And yes, that does matter.

(11 Nov '09, 18:58) Vesuvius

Ultimately, the whole notion that there is no right or wrong just doesn't ring true. It suggests that nothing is important, that nothing matters. You can talk about what people in different cultures consider right or wrong, if you like; you can talk all day long about how people have the right to choose what to believe, but you really can't say that there is not a difference between things that are preferable (good) and things that are not (bad).

(11 Nov '09, 19:07) Vesuvius

I thinks there is an right and a wrong but it is according to our perception of right and wrong.

(12 Nov '09, 07:25) flowingwater
showing 2 of 4 show 2 more comments

Yes, we all see what we want to see. There is no right or wrong. How can there be? We are all so different and think in different ways. So what you believe is good might not be regarded as good by somebody else.

You will only see what you belief in. And if you feel good about what you believe in and as a result what you are seeing, then that is good enough. It does not matter what everybody else believes in and sees.

We can still all live in harmony and other people's beliefs will only affect them not us. Only your beliefs will affect you.


answered 11 Nov '09, 21:36

Pink%20Diamond's gravatar image

Pink Diamond

Provided that we live in a free society, where we can still make choices about what we think and how we live. The only way that such a society can maintain its existence is by having standards about the way people treat each other, so that other peoples' rights to live freely are not infringed.

(11 Nov '09, 22:36) Vesuvius

I think there is an right and a wrong but it is according to our perceptions of right and wrong.

(12 Nov '09, 07:24) flowingwater

Beliefs are simply that beliefs what you believe to be true in your inner world that maybe you have tried out for your self. You may have beliefs that conflict with other people beliefs but maybe they work for you from personal experiences.

Now you know people believe what they want to believe once they are grown adults. So, you might believe in lizard men because you have seen them or knew someone who has seen them. But others don't believe in them simply because this is out of the norm and they have not seen them personally and therefore they don't believe in them.

One of your beliefs might be that UFO are real because You have seen them or knew someone who have seen them. You might believe in the healing of energies throughout our bodies of many diseases.

Keep an open mind about things but don't take everything at face value either reguardless of how many credentials are behind their names. There are so many things that people would reveil but they would be immediately label crazy simply because it does not fit in the round hole of normal life; it is an square peg. It doesn't mean it is not true just that people chose not to believe it to be true or correct. It is all according to the preceptions of people's known beliefs or knowledge, how open minded they are, and how tested the data out to be true or not according to your terms of beliefs.

Beliefs are what you have come to terms with are true and correct as far as your knowledge is and what you have learn from others. Example I have not been to see none of the oceans but I believe they are there.

Beliefs are simply what you believe to be true by your own observations or others who you believe to be true. You will believe it until you find out it is not true for you.

There are a lot of things that exists without us knowing about it; millions or billions of things yet to be discovered or re-discovered because the bible says there is nothing new. Now rather we believe they exist when we here about it, see it, or read about it depends on our own belief system and rather we trust what we hear, see or read.

If we saw something that was out of the norm and if someone else saw it with you it is more believable to others. But rather anyone else saw it with you are not it is still real but rather you believe it is will be another matter. We have not discovered everthing there is to discover and probably want ever for God's creation is vast and man's deverstation of creating through gentic mutation is great and not know by but an very few.

I remember when I was an girl they were working on making an man to have guills and being able to breathe under water like an fish. You don't here of anything about that now but don't you know they are out there they may have delete the project because of lack of funds, death of the inventer, it didn't turn out the way they wanted it to or they went on to something else.


answered 12 Nov '09, 05:51

flowingwater's gravatar image


edited 12 Nov '09, 19:59

You seem to have glossed over the fact that something can simply exist, without the benefit of a person's belief to validate it. Conversely, a person may believe that something exists, but the reality can be different. The UFO that the person believes they saw can be a weather balloon, for example.

(12 Nov '09, 15:43) Vesuvius

No, Vesuvius things exist because they are real and exist but do we believe in them that they are real will be according to our own experiences and others we have come to trust. There are millions of things yet to be discovered. It does not exist because of our belief now it might stand out more and have more power or become more present in our existance in our reality because of our belief but it does exist because it does exist. I am sorry I didn't mean to skip over it but I just dealth more with our belief than rather it really did exist. What have you seen that exist out of the norm?

(12 Nov '09, 19:30) flowingwater

I will add more to my answer Vesuvius.

(12 Nov '09, 19:31) flowingwater
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Asked: 11 Nov '09, 05:53

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Last updated: 12 Nov '09, 19:59

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