Before anyone jumps into thinking I am being sacrilegious, let me amplify this question.

“I am trying here to prevent anyone saying the really foolish thing that people often say about Him: I’m ready to accept Jesus as a great moral teacher, but I don’t accept his claim to be God. That is the one thing we must not say. A man who was merely a man and said the sort of things Jesus said would not be a great moral teacher. He would either be a lunatic — on the level with the man who says he is a poached egg — or else he would be the Devil of Hell. You must make your choice. Either this man was, and is, the Son of God, or else a madman or something worse. You can shut him up for a fool, you can spit at him and kill him as a demon or you can fall at his feet and call him Lord and God, but let us not come with any patronizing nonsense about his being a great human teacher. He has not left that open to us. He did not intend to.” - CS Lewis "Mere Christianity"

I welcome your opinions and comments.

asked 07 Aug '13, 08:54

Dollar%20Bill's gravatar image

Dollar Bill

edited 07 Aug '13, 18:31

@Dollar Bill - "Was Jesus insane, a madman" - I must admit that what caught my eye about this question was not the question itself but why you make a distinction between insanity and madness :)

(07 Aug '13, 16:51) Stingray

@stingray good point, you might say that all people of genius are mad, it is only a social thing whether they are sane or insane. Based on this I am changing the question from madman, insane, etc.

(07 Aug '13, 18:20) Dollar Bill

Whatever he was, you can't leave it that he was only a "great moral teacher." He had to have been more than that.

(07 Aug '13, 18:35) Dollar Bill

You left out alien...

(08 Aug '13, 04:19) ele

@ele - "You left out alien..." - Indeed. I've heard Bashar categorically state that Jesus (along with a number of other spiritual "giants" such as Buddha) was actually an alien hybrid...which puts a different slant on the Virgin Birth idea:

(08 Aug '13, 04:34) Stingray

That was my thinkin' @Stingray lol! Great article! 8-8-13 Thanks. Virgin birth makes more sense to me now. (The story is ALWAYS in the comments) Thanks for the support!

(08 Aug '13, 04:53) ele

WoW Bill, you got a down vote. When I voted you up, you had one vote. Congratulations!

(08 Aug '13, 05:21) ele

@ele - "The story is ALWAYS in the comments" - You mean the Devil is in the details? Wanna borrow a pitchfork? :)

(08 Aug '13, 08:17) Stingray

lol! Sure if you have one you're not using @Stingray

(08 Aug '13, 08:44) ele

If the Bible was false and Jesus was no human but alien then why would he bother telling us we are like him children of light? The things he does we can do? If he was alien then we can't, it is not in our genes. I believe it as it said God became human for us to show us what we are capable of.

(08 Aug '13, 23:37) Wade Casaldi

Alien means non-earthling.

(09 Aug '13, 01:00) ele

@ele yes alien, non-earthling. A space alien would have no business trying to teach us what he does we could do. That would be like a human trying to tell an ape he could do anything that we could. Different brain, different abilities.

If Jesus was an alien it would make him saying the things I do you can do, wrong.

(09 Aug '13, 03:12) Wade Casaldi

@Wade I mean NO disrespect. Have you ever heard of physicist Brian Greene's work regarding the 'multiverse' (our Universe is just one of many)? Multiple Big Bangs?Parallel planets w/ beings just like us having convo's just like we are having now & looking just like us? They are non earthlings. It's a cosmic bubble bath! What about astronomer Jill Tartar, directer of SETI for 10 yrs & her work with UFO's & common cosmic origins ( a billion year linage of stardust)?

(09 Aug '13, 04:28) ele

As I found out through the recent post on the embarrasing fox news interview, Jesus may possibly best fit the category as "renegade cult leader." Try an active political and belief-changing criminal in Zealot: The life of Jesus Christ

(09 Aug '13, 07:21) Nikulas

He was an attention whore. Probably smart as well, figured doing what he did would get him remembered and talked about for thousands of years. Maybe sentimentally clinging onto known saying "you live as long as they remember you".

(09 Aug '13, 07:37) CalonLan
showing 1 of 16 show 15 more comments

None of the above. Jesus was enlightened. What he said has been so thoroughly changed throughout history that his original message has been lost.

1) Jesus didn't believe in sin. He thought that people, in their spiritual ignorance, made mistakes causing harm to themselves and others. That isn't sin. The word he used was translated into Koine Greek as Hamartia. Hamartia is not sin. It's a mistake.

2) Jesus didn't believe in hell. He spoke of Gehenna - the garbage dump outside of jerusalem's city gates. There, those who lives the most wretched of lives eeked out a meager existence while living in misery.

3) There was no word like "repent" until the 17th century and the release of the King James Version. Jesus spoke of Metanoeo and Metamellamai, which mean - change your way of thinking and change your way of emoting - respectively.

Put these together. He is saying that if your life is wretched, you need only give up your ignorance to change your way of thinking and emoting to be lifted out of your misery. When you know how powerful your thoughts and emotions are, nothing is denied you (by you).

The whole crucifiction scene was to have played this out. when he was taken into custody, it was inconceivable that he would be released, but according to the oldest available texts, he was released. They say that bar abba was released. The term "bar abba" is not a name. It's a description. It means son of Daddy (familiar vs. formal word father). As Jesus' Daddy was loving and gives ALL that is asked for, one could justify calling abba "Sugar Daddy". Jesus was called bar abba. The name Barabbas did not appear in history until the 3rd century.

With the appearance of the Internet, Christian scholars have discovered this horrible mistake. But if bar abba didn't die on the cross, the religion would fail. The money would dry up and the leaders would lose their power. Rather than expose the newly discovered truth, Christianity expanded the lie. The new Bibles give Jesus a last name. Now he is known as Jesus Barabbas who stood next to Barabbas, even though they know that Barabbas was not a name until no less than two and a half centuries later.

The balcony scene was meant to show the people how powerful they are and why they had no reason to fear either the San Hedron or Caesar. THAT is how powerful they are. The release was the Christian story - not the crucifixion. But Constantine changed that.

Jesus didn't believe in the christian "God". His beliefs were far more consistent with the New Age interpretation of Quantum Mechanics. We are one. As I do to you, I do to me and that which Christians call God, but I call an energy field. He was an egalitarian, so he was no megalomaniac and did not have a Messiah complex. The messiah is within us. the kingdom of heaven (wisdom/consciousness) is a counselor. It is also great power.

He said ALL that you ask for is given (so if you don't like what you have, simply change your beliefs (lose ignorance), change your way of thinking and emoting, and what you want will appear in your reality. Those of us who do this do in-fact bring things into our realities that would not otherwise be able to. Jesus said that by our words we are condemned or justified. Words are powerful and as we are gods using them, we should wield them with more care.

Jesus was no Christian. That was Paul's handiwork. Jesus was a rational anarchist and perhaps a Pantheist. Paul taught the opposite of what Jesus taught. Paul was in it for the money and power. He started the Christian church. Jesus tried to bring down religion - all religions that control what people may think.


answered 07 Aug '13, 09:19

Gail's gravatar image


edited 07 Aug '13, 09:21

@Gail - you speak with a great deal of authority and conviction. I am not here to argue points, but I would like to know your references. Maybe we could all learn something.

(07 Aug '13, 20:53) Dollar Bill

@Gail very interesting stuff! I know of some things you said such as sin means mistake. That was even preached in our church. But you also posted a bunch of things I haven't heard before. Interesting to ponder.

(08 Aug '13, 06:14) Wade Casaldi

Now i was gonna give a more incomplete anwswer, but pretty much this guy's way to put it... Jesus was an enlightened person, even the bible says he said (not textually because I don't remember it exactly) "All I can do (Jesus) you can also do" to us, so in fact I think we're not only able, we are supposed to look forward to being pretty much like him, enlightened, maybe with our own few separate ideas and thoughts.

(08 Aug '13, 07:10) Justice_and_Truth
showing 2 of 3 show 1 more comments

You ask "Was Jesus Lord..."
But the relevant question is "Is Jesus Lord..." a source of insperation,solice,goodness in your life NOW and with that you could insert which ever diety / spirtual leaders name and dogma...
It is what do they add to your life view NOW that is the important question. Not the misconstrued,edited ,rewritten ,misunderstood ,misinterpreted views of others that you should place your values on.


answered 08 Aug '13, 01:44

ursixx's gravatar image


I think there have been many 'wise men' and 'prophets' for longer than our recorded history.

In my opinion their message to humanity has largely been the same since the dawn of time, which I'd personally translate as "We can be so much more." Depending on the challenges facing the person or group at the time of encounter the content would be adapted to be as immediately suitable as possible, but the overall tone of the message is always the same and the behavior of the 'prophet' usually very similar.

Because of this, I strongly dislike the idea Jesus taught any message implying he was superior to anyone else, nor he could do anything other's couldn't. Anything along the lines of "You need me to be saved" or "The only way to heaven and/or God is through me" in my eyes seem highly uncharacteristic of his message and the person he was.

I believe his primary purpose was trying to tell people they were paying for salvation for souls that were never damned in the first place which those addicted to power didn't appreciate. I believe many of his teachings were omitted, as well as claims he said things which are dramatically misinterpreted beyond holding any relevancy to original meaning.

History is written by the victor. Jesus spoke out against the church and was crucified, the rest is history.


answered 09 Aug '13, 11:58

Snow's gravatar image



snow, a hierarchy does exist, the top levels with more wisdom and compassion, giving notice and direction to the path. periodically as dire needs presents the avatar intervenes on behalf of the Father

(09 Aug '13, 20:45) fred

legends are of heroes
great people, Jesus be man
but at the Jordan with John
became a temple for
Divine Spirit


answered 07 Aug '13, 21:06

fred's gravatar image


Was Jesus "the one and only Son of God", or "merely" an extraordinary human being? I suppose there is no way to prove it either way 100%.

Judging by the historical testimony of non-Christians of the era such as Josephus, it seems pretty certain that the person known as Jesus was doing some pretty miraculous things, and garnering a large following because of it. So at the very least it seems that he was an expert "conscious" manifester.

Although I am huge C.S. Lewis fan, I do not share the sentiment of his quotation above.

Because if someone was somehow able to prove that Jesus was "only" a mere mortal, I would still find his advice about faith, compassion, and the power of belief just as pertinent, useful, and relevant as it ever was.

I sometimes wonder if the focus on Christ's divinity (the "worship", if you will) distracts from the examination and application of his actual advice.

It is perhaps worth quoting the following passage from the opening to the Gospel of John:

"But those that received him, to them he gave authority to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his Name..."

So even if he is the Son of God, he is saying that we all have the potential to become children of God.


answered 07 Aug '13, 23:39

lozenge123's gravatar image


@Lozenge123 - Jesus, like us, was spirit and man. He was better connected than most of us. But even so, He spent a lot of time in prayer (meditation), perhaps in His Vortex.

Certainly we are all children of God, or Source, depending on how you want to characterize God. My question is more about the concept of sacrifice and suffering. I do not understand it. Seems to make no sense.

(08 Aug '13, 09:45) Dollar Bill

@Dollar Bill - I agree, the suffering thing makes no sense. As far as I know, no where in the bible does Jesus tell people that they should or must suffer. That seems to be a later Christian thing. (He does tell people to give up certain attachments, but i dont count that as the same thing). My best guess is that this is people taking the idea of "imitating Christ" a bit too literally, coupled with the massive focus on the event of the crucifixion above everything else that Jesus said and did.

(08 Aug '13, 10:23) lozenge123

This is what is in the Bible on suffering.

(08 Aug '13, 23:48) Wade Casaldi

@Wade Casaldi - Wow, thanks for that, how revealing! Indeed, all the suffering-focused material seems to come later in the post-Jesus books such as Romans, Timothy, James, Phillipians, etc..

(09 Aug '13, 01:52) lozenge123
showing 2 of 4 show 2 more comments

I have a slightly different take than most.

I believe my own identity is Jesus Christ. I firmly believe im Him. I also believe everyone else is too, and I mean everyone. I think Jesus Christ is the totality of all humanity, any other race or alien culture ( if there are any ) and every thing in this world or any other.

In fact I believe there "ONLY" Christ in any reality and nothing else. To say "was" about consciousness doesn't make any sense to me. There cant be a was because consciousness only knows now. There never was a was, if you know what I mean.

The Biblical Christ only exists "now" . The Christian interpretation of him as a physical person is accurate only in as much as it describes "us".... "now" .

I know many will disagree with this and find it rather offensive. I understand this. However all of us exist "now" so how can anyone comment or speculate about "then". There is no then! Then doesn't exist, and even if it did no one has ANY consciousness of it.


answered 07 Aug '13, 12:57

Monty%20Riviera's gravatar image

Monty Riviera


Jesus can't be the now if "you" are the "now", you can follow his path, but your consciousness is still yours, not Jesus'. He is in you, yes, and you are in him, yes... couldn't argue about that, but unless you are in his time and in his moments, it's hard to say you or anyone is Jesus of Nasareth...

(08 Aug '13, 07:52) Justice_and_Truth

No...I think you've misunderstood my post. I am Jesus Christ, Im not following his "path" Him. And its very easy for me to say that...because I know who I am.

(08 Aug '13, 23:50) Monty Riviera

IMO, if one were to bow at Jesus' knee and proclaim him God the Father, that would be lunacy.

Without passages quoted from Gospel, it's challenging to understand how anyone identifies Jesus as (the one and only) God. As I've been over passages where that sort of thing is interpreted (and really adding to what's there), it is easy for me to see that Jesus didn't self identify as Lord, God, nor Messiah.

He is certainly legend. And if you believe in the resurrection, you could say He is a living legend ;-)

I would say he is closest to Guru / advanced teacher. As in still is, but for sure was. He was clearly showing 'the way' and doing so often via parables where reading between the lines was critical to (advanced) understanding of his message. Yet, when he speaks about '2 greatest commandments' it is fairly direct in what 'the way' is.

The lunatic thing will always be present around him as teacher, for when you say something like "I and the Father are one" and don't back down from such a claim, well everyone who either doubts the Father or doubts a human could possibly know this, will plausibly deem the assertion as crazy talk. Then there are those amongst us who think the messenger is his message, thus not just crazy talk, but instead crazy person. But as anyone can clearly say 'I and the Father are one' (and be correct in doing so), it begs a reasonable person to consider what that message is saying.

Still waiting on that CS Lewis version where Jesus must've said, "I, and only me, and the Father are one. In fact, just call me Jesus 'Father' and we'll be cool." Without that being stated in Gospel, I'm thinking there are lunatic disciples amongst us who are conveying a much different message than the one that is readily available for all to see.


answered 08 Aug '13, 11:59

Jman's gravatar image


Jefferson Moore (playing Jesus) did a good job answering this and other questions in, The Perfect Stranger and Another Perfect Stranger.

Your question reminded me of these films I'd like to share now.


answered 07 Aug '13, 22:23

Wade%20Casaldi's gravatar image

Wade Casaldi

edited 09 Aug '13, 03:22

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