Father,Son,Holy spirt. three differnt persons that form ONE god. How many agree and how many disagree??
I personally do agree because for evryhting that is unique and essential for life comes in three, for example. H20 being the molecular formula that is water is divided into three SEPERATE elements yet CONSISTS of the same molecular formula...h20(water). And with water comes the liquid form, ice the solid form, and steam the gas form. even though all are SEPERATE elements they still are of the SAME SOURCE....WATER!
and you can also use humans for example. even though we are only ONE physical being, we have 3 SEPERATE ASPECTS TO US. MIND, BODY, AND SOUL! even though these three are SEPERATE aspects of that physical being, they still are of the SAME BEING! (person).
so as you can see, if WE have these three aspects THAT FORM our being, and us being made in GODS IMAGE, then of course this concept must ALSO APPLY TO GOD ALMIGHTY!
Hi Mebb, I agree with the statements you have made. I would also like to add to your explanation a little further.
Years ago when I honestly looked at this question, this is what I found.
It was said that the doctrine of the Trinity teaches that there is one God, yet three distinct persons, each person is the same in substance and equal in and power and glory .
I had discovered an interesting verse in the bible that helped me understand the trinity question more clearly. Hope this will help you.
In Roman 1:20 it says, (I have included verse 19 to show its context)
19: Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. 20: For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
Basically this is saying that, we can understand the invisible things of him by the things that are made/created or in other words by what we physically see and comprehend. This most definitely includes understanding his eternal power and Godhead as it is stated in verse 20.
Definition: Godhead n. 1. Divinity; godhood. 2. Godhead a) The Christian God, especially the Trinity. b) The essential and divine nature of God, regarded abstractly. (The union of the Father and Son and Holy Ghost in one Godhead)(http://www.thefreedictionary.com/godhead)
The trinity is regarded abstractly for those that do not comprehend its nature or make-up.
So back to the question, How can we understand the trinity (the invisible thing) with what God created (what we can see).
The universe is basically made up of 3 parts. Einstein's theory of relativity revealed the fact that life as we know it consists of three things, time, matter, and space (which is energy).
If one of these elements were removed, the universe as we know it would cease to exist. All three elements are needed so the universe can be (i.e. exist).
Each of these 3 elements (time, matter and space) in turn are made up of 3 parts also.
Time is made up of 3 parts. They are; the past, present and future. If one of these elements were removed, time as we know it would cease to exist. If there is no past the present could not advance into the future to create a past. If there were no present, there definitely would not be a past and future. If there was no future, the present would not be able to move forward.
Matter is made up of atoms. All atoms consist of three basic components, protons, neutrons and electrons. A proton is not a neutron, a neutron is not an electron, and an electron is not a proton. One is not the other, all are part of the same, none can exist without the other (and still remain a complete atom), and yet each is distinct!
Matter is invisible at its core yet we can perceive it.
Two thousand years ago the writer of Hebrew's wrote:
Heb. 11:3 By faith we understand that the worlds were prepared by the word of God, so that what is seen was not made out of things which are visible.
Re-read this until you understand what it saying. By faith we understand...that*,* what is seen*,* was not made*,* out of things which are visible.
(Side note: If man wrote the bible, how could he write something that he didn't know about. We only discovered atoms at the invention of powerful microscopes. Man is catching up to the bible. This is one example of the divine inspiration of the scriptures.)
We now know this to be a fact because of microscopes. When things are magnified to its minutest level we found it to be energy.
Matter is made up of 3 parts. They are; gases, solids and liquids. If one of these elements were removed, matter as we know it would cease to exist. As an example, take water. In this form it is a liquid. If the element of gases were to be removed, matter as we know it would cease to exist because you would not be able to boil water which once boiled turns into a gas. If solids were to be removed, matter as we know it would cease to exist, because water in a liquid form when frozen would not be able to become/transform into a solid.
Space is made up of 3 parts. They are; length, width and height. Look to the upper corner part of the room you're in right now and notice the three 'walls' i.e. the ceiling, the wall going to the left and the one going to the right. Each wall has an element to it. One supplies the length, one supplies the width and one supplies the height. These three elements make up the concept of space or 3 dimensions. If one of these elements were removed, space as we know it would cease to exist.
A question now comes up. In this example of space, which element (length, width or height) is the most important or which element is the greatest and which is the least?
Would you say that they are all equally the same and important? Could one element be the head or number 1?
When we perceive the 'space' in a room, we realize that no one element can be greater than another. They all perform the duty they were created to do.
Space is an invisible concept yet we comprehend it by the walls we built around ourselves.
Here is another way to explain it:
Space is a trinity of elements: the length, the width, and the height. The length is not the same element as the width; the width is not the same element as the height; and the height is not the same element as the length. They are separate elements; yet, they are all the one space. They are in absolute perfect harmony consisting of one substance. They are coequal, and copowerful. If any one of the three were removed, there would be no space.
Using the above logic, I now apply it to the concept of the trinity.
God is a trinity of persons: the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost. The Father is not the same person as the Son; the Son is not the same person as the Holy Ghost; and the Holy Ghost is not the same person as Father. They are separate persons; yet, they are all the one God. They are in absolute perfect harmony consisting of one substance. They are coeternal, coequal, and copowerful. If any one person of the three were removed, there would be no God.
1 John 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
Main stream thought about the trinity is that 1+1+1=3. Their basic premise is that three persons cannot make one person (visible form). The trinity should not be added but multiplied i.e. 1x1x1=1. The premise for this is that when one calculates volume, you multiply the length by the width by the height. This gives you the total space of a given area (invisible form).
Some other examples of tri-unity in unity.
Man is triune in nature. He is made up of a spirit, a soul, and a body. The moment that one of these elements is taken out or removed, man as we know him, ceases to exist (in this plane).
1 Thessalonians 5:23 And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.
How about the human mind?
Scientists tell us that the human mind is the most complex thing in the universe. The is also a trinity. The mind, the will, and the emotions. Your mind, (intellect) is not the same as your emotions. Your emotions are not the same as your will. One is not the other, all are part of the same, none can exist without the other, and yet each is distinct!
Someone had made this observation about the sun once.
Direct sunlight has a luminous efficacy of about 93 lumens per watt of radiant flux, which includes infrared, visible, and ultraviolet light. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sunlight)
Infrared light can be felt but not seen. (Holy Ghost) Visible light can be seen and felt. (The Son) Ultraviolet light can't be seen or felt. (The Father)
There are other examples I have that I can use. I hope you have enough information here to help you begin to comprehend and grasp this concept of the trinity.
All the best.
I think Kabbala explains this concept quite well - and there is a Christian Cabbala.
Kether, Chokmah and Binah - which can be described as Father, Son and Holy Ghost. Also these three are 'reflected' at the level of manifestation... as we try to be a reflection of Our Father who art in Heaven.
Kabbala/Cabbala/Qabala is not for the faint hearted... but it you take it a little at a time and see where your personal belief system fits in - it can be a very useful tool.
Alchemy/Hermetics/Kabbala/Christianity etc etc ... all say the same thing. By trying to understand one you start to understand the other.
It was only when I studied Latin that my Enlish grammar improved. It was only when I studied horticulture that my understanding of the human body improved. It was only when I started to study the symbols and stories of many different cultures that my understanding of the Bible improved. Mountains, valleys, temples, plains, forests .. all have other meanings.
Three persons cannot make one other person no matter how mystical. I would have to vote that there are three parts to God.
We are body, soul and spirit and one person. Maybe the Trinity is something along those lines, but so far above our capacity to comprehend that we might never be able to adequately explain it.
answered 15 Feb '10, 06:32
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(John 1: 1) In the beginning was the word; the word was with God, and God was the word. And it when on to say that everything was created by the power of the word by God!
Jesus said: I am in the father, and the father is in me! The son is in the father; the father is in the son; and they both came from the same spirit source God, the soul of all creation. God created man out of clay, giving man a physical body; he breathe the breath of life into man nostrils giving man life to breathe, life, and function as a human being; he also gave man the spirit of language to speak; and a soul that will never die, because it is from the same spirit source God, the soul of all creation.
So based upon what we know, don’t know, or what we want to believe, and if I may dare say, the truth is the truth, and the truth may be different to everyone. But nonetheless, God is God; the son is the son; and the Holy Ghost is the spirit. They are three different things from the same source; therefore, they are one, and the same thing. The father, the son, and the Holy Ghost! Of course, it is called the Holy Trinity.
Regardless, of how you may want to look at it, the fact is, everything is indeed from the same source, the first cause, and everything in life is very spiritual, that is why life remains a mystery based upon the spiritual aspect of all living things, and our existing Universe.
You can be your own best judge in terms of what you believe the Holy Trinity to be, but in essence there is only one God, one source, and one truth. An example: The truth is everyone’s blood is the same color “Red,” why, because we are all one, and same human, and all humans have blood in their veins, and the color is red; and it is also a fact of life that we cannot change this truth, but we must accept it, why, because we do not have a choice; it is what it is, and this is the way we are created!
I have this theory that they are different levels of representation.
I wrote about this in my blog
My own concept of "The Trinity" is the conscious, the inconscious or subconscious, and the heart. When these three are all together, you are able to make miracles. When I do cross sign, I often say: in the name of conscious (what I want consciously) in the name of the subconscious (what I want inside of me very deap) and in the name of my heart: what my heart wants me to do. If I obtain unicity... It's won. In the LOA trinity is for me: 1) what you ask 2) what you believe 3) what you receive. Excuse my poor english, I shall improve it's promished!
answered 15 Feb '10, 18:14
I like what was told to Patricia King through the Holy Spirit, it is God's spirit man self, in other words the most personal part of God, God gave us that too. The true essence from which we come is our Spirit man the Holy Spirit is God's true essence self, that core being of God. God loves us so much he left nothing from us he even gave us his true essence self, his spirit man self.
This makes a lot of sense since the Holy spirit is held in such high esteem in the Bible that this is most personal to God's nature of existence, just as our spirit man is most personal to our existence.
The closest I can think of to represent this is if we said to a friend i am going to let you access my brain, you can access my conscious, my subconscious and even my supra conscious mind. That is a lot many would say wait you can't know what I did as a child, or what I did last year when I was at my lowest. But God hid nothing and said I give you everything my entire self, so the same we give God when we chose to be reborn in the Holy Spirit as a new creation of God's love.
IN REGARDS TO THE QUESTION OF THE "TRINITY" (SPIRITUAL) AND "WATER" (MATTER), AND HOW ENTITIES OR ENERGIES ARE PARTS CONTRIBUTING TO THE WHOLE IS FUNDAMENTALLY VERY SCIENTIFIC
FOR EXAMPLE: ATOMS, ENERGY, AND MATTER
JUST ANOTHER EXAMPLE OF THREE SIDES OF THE SAME COIN (THE EXPRESSION IS TWO SIDES OF THE SAME COIN... BUT YOU GET THE PICTURE)
TO BROADEN THE CONCEPT IN QUESTION, MAYBE AT TIMES SCIENCE AND SPIRITUALITY ARE TWO SIDES OF THE SAME COIN
WHEN A FAITH BELIEVER IS OBSERVING A MIRACLE, ON THE OTHER SIDE A SCIENTIST IS OBSERVING A SINGULARITY (IN SCIENCE, A SINGULARITY IS A POINT WHERE THE PREDICTABLE NATURE OF PHYSICS BREAKS DOWN)
BUT LET THE RECORD BE KNOWN THAT SINGULARITIES ARE EXTREMELY RARE THAT THE BIBLE MAKE THEM OUT TO BE THE RULE RATHER THAN THE EXCEPTION !
answered 28 Mar '10, 17:36
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