IQ plays a big role on my new found spirituality. I came here to learn the Law of Attraction, but what I found is larger, and bigger, and more profound. I started to open my mind to non-biblical concepts like aliens, reincarnation, karma, and the concept that there is no evil but only the absence of good, and there is no dark but only an absence of light. I embrace within myself that the Bible is not the absolute authority of Gods Words, but only a part of the whole. I started to accept that God is not a separate being than me, but rather I am a part of Him.
I stop to view the biblical God as a separate being sitting in His throne and watching my every step, ready to throw me to hell if He is not pleased on what I am doing. I stop to see God as a being that is hunger of worship and appreciation and adoration. I still adore Him, and worship Him but not the way that I need to do it because He requires it from me.
The word 'I AM' for now has new meaning to me. When God said said 'I AM that I AM' and when Jesus said 'I am' the way, the truth, and the life. I address it to myself and embraced it without a doubt that that I am a part of that 'I AM'.
Bashar resonates on me so much that my chest is like lifted by my surgical heart every time I listened to him in YouTube. I randomly picked a video of Bashar in no particular order but each video make sense to me and I felt overwhelmed by everything that he said. I accept him without any speckle of doubt and I felt I lost my ability to reason with his videos.
I also listened to Abraham on how to manifest things that I want. Though the feeling is not as much as I have with Bashar I followed the experiments outlined by Stingray for the Law of Attraction. And I do not consider Abraham any less, I believe she (or he) is as important as the Bible, the Koran, Bashar, Eckhart, etc.
As you can see I am embracing new things, I am more open, and I have different mindset than before. I still go to church in Sundays. The difference now is that the sermons are less relevant to me. The preaching, although good, losses its grip in my being.
I am (or more precisely WAS) a closed minded Christian who accept nothing other than what is written in the Bible. I worship God, I love Jesus (and I still is), I pray and cry to God in supplication, I asked for forgiveness of my sins in a regular basis, I follow almost everything what is told behind the pulpit.
I felt I am a Christian no more, not in a sense that I deny Jesus in my life but in a sense that what I was believing are not the whole truth.
However, I have one fear of what I am now and this is the reason why I am asking if I just outgrow the Bible or I becoming more of what the bible foretold.
What can you say about this? I want to hear your thoughts.
asked 22 May '13, 12:35
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I feel pretty much the same way you do about it.
There is certainly nothing to feel bad or alarmed about, since so much of what is termed "Christianity" to day has evolved (or devolved) pretty far from what the individual referred to as Jesus taught in the various accounts and scriptures.
If you dive into the Bashar, Abraham, and metaphysical stuff, and then re-read the New Testament, you'll find out that there is a huge amount of overlap.
It is written that Jesus said, "All things are possible to them that believe," and it is a concept that is repeated throughout the various scriptures.
However, I have yet to attend a modern sermon where this sort of stuff is given any attention.
For that matter, I have met very few "Christians" who take these words of Jesus seriously. If pressed, they would say "Well, he couldn't have really meant what he said." And the one or two individuals that I know who do take it seriously, are also heavily into this metaphysical stuff.
So, for these and other reasons, I have come to accept that the vast majority of people calling themselves "Christians" today are not actually adhering to or following the original material.
Most (not all) of my experiences in modern churches have actually been sort of depressing rather than uplifting. There is the usual acknowledgment of all the bad things going on in the world, how dark it all is, and how we can "cope" with it through the teachings of the bible, and by worshiping Christ. It actually kind of brings one down.
There is also this massive focus on the suffering of Christ on the cross, how horribly he was treated, and how we should feel awful about it, and so grateful to him. Why is this so?
Christ came back from the dead, and he didn't seem too bent out of shape about it. He had some holes in his palms, and felt good enough about it that he could order a doubting disciple to poke his fingers through the holes. He left us with some more uplifting messages and then took off for somewhere else. Sounds like cause for joy to me. Nothing in there such as "Remember my suffering and remember to feel bad about it!"
It is also written in the bible, "By their fruits you shall know them." If I apply this by looking to other Christians, I have to say that the vast majority I know are sad, somewhat frustrated, often depressed people. It seems that something is not right there. Either the teachings are not helpful, or they are not being understood or applied (I choose to give Christianity the benefit of the doubt and go with the latter).
Whereas, I always come away feeling great, inspired, and positive, from watching any Bashar seminar...even just a ten minute clip.
I think much of the teachings and focus of Bashar and Abraham is actually closer to the original teachings of Jesus that 99.999% of modern sermons preached today in Christian churches.
I mean, even the title of Abraham's book "Ask and it is given," is taken from the mouth of Jesus.
How much more blunt can you get?
That all said, I have been to three Christian churches (out of a very large number) where I have had an inspiring and uplifting experience. So there is that.
answered 22 May '13, 16:47
I can say nothing more @lozenge123. I can see the huge overlap between the Bible and this new things I found... I can see now a deeper meaning of what has been written, it is hard for me to explain for now but it goes like this: I am no longer judgmental to those teachings that do not conform to my belief; I believe that the Bible is not the sole authority for truth; Islam is also a work of God, and so is Hinduism and other form of religion, and even Science; etcetera etcetera... and so on...
(22 May '13, 22:34) Romel
Well said Lozenge and I agree with you!
(23 May '13, 21:43) LeeAnn 1
Yes lozenge123. We agree. Christianity is not being taught today by the humans who teach it as Jesus would teach it today.
(23 Jun '13, 13:50) atalanta
showing 2 of 3 show 1 more comments
There are many levels of understanding of the Bible. What you have outgrown is being satisfied being a baby Christian. If you believe you have outgrown the Bible then you will deny yourself finding Christ within.
@Romel They might think so but they are content being baby Christians. You have taken your first step towards being Christian as a student of Jesus instead of a student of the church.
You are the temple of the living God. Now think meditate on Christ, and Jesus teaching. Even meditate of the difference between the Christ and Jesus. If your body is God's temple, who are you?
Meditate daily on the scriptures, you will find the Bible goes very deep in metaphysics. The Bible is ment to be understood at all levels of intelligence.
Sadly most never get past the basics even ministers. This is because the masses are not ready to find out yet.
It is an easier path to fear and feel helpless. But someone that really knows the Bible would know that is a lie. There is nothing to fear and we absolutely are not helpless.
If you want to see the power of Christians, watch, The Finger Of God or Furious Love. Both are powerful, do not let unbelief stop you. Instead let this build your faith, you are very powerful!
I just cast a demon out of someone. It fought me but it was no match for me because I know I and my father God are one.
answered 22 May '13, 14:08
You're right sir @Wade Casaldi, I think now it is not about the Bible but about the teachings from the Bible interpreted by the Christian group I am in. I consider the people inside as my family and I am still a part of them. But I am for now 'not' open yet to who I really am about my belief and my feelings to the teachings... I hope I will find the courage to do so, I am sure I will be misinterpreted and maybe labeled differently. :)
(22 May '13, 22:39) Romel
Sir @Wade Casaldi, I watched the 'Finger of God' movie and I cry. I am not that type, as much as possible I will hold my tears, but I can't help it with this movie. It touched me so much... Why I did not pursue to ministry? That was my desire when I was young. I enrolled to engineering and yes I am now a professional engineer but there is a hole in my heart, and this is what I'm looking... Gonna watch 'Furious Love' too...
(24 May '13, 06:27) Romel
@Romal everything is falling into place. Think about this; had you gone to be a minister you might have let that keep you from here or hearing me. You may have become like those ministers that you now feel you have outgrown. You choose correctly to now pursue being a minster that awakens the children of light.
(24 May '13, 10:07) Wade Casaldi
More people need to know they are powerful and dearly loved sons and daughters of God. I think you will make a great minister because you ASK Ask, Seek and Knock. That is what God wants, that we awaken to who and what we are.
(24 May '13, 10:08) Wade Casaldi
Check out xpmedia http://www.xpmedia.com/
Patrica King, Heidi Baker, Sid Roth and many other Christians that know their divine strength in God are here.
(24 May '13, 10:18) Wade Casaldi
Have you ever wanted to sit down and have dinner with Jesus? Good food and good conversation are being experienced as you and Jesus talk and eat together. Watch the movie The Perfect Stranger starring Jefferson Moore. He also made Another Perfect Stranger, and The Perfect Gift. He also made The Stranger mini series.
To learn what real forgiveness is watch Amish Grace. For relationships watch Fire Proof.
(24 May '13, 10:59) Wade Casaldi
Here is a movie about breaking the mold to be a minister. http://www.itbn.org/index/detail/lib/Programs/sublib/Movies/ec/NvM24wMzqW-kgNx7ilCtlVwPgquz-3ah
It is very good and shows how it is really all about love. She the minister changes a whole town, with love.
(24 May '13, 11:17) Wade Casaldi
showing 2 of 7 show 5 more comments
The Bible is full of wisdom, it has just been misunderstood, misinterpreted and misused. Coming here and learning about the Law of Attraction and the metaphysical aspects, I came to understand the Bible with new eyes, a new understanding. Jesus said that if we believed, we could move mountains. I didn't see that happening, nor did I hear it preached at church. I started at a Friends church, or Quaker. They had the purest understanding of the Christian churches that I went to. After that, they were more right wing conservative and less empowered by Christianity, and more subserviant.
Even though the Bible says not to fear many times, fear is preached in church. The Bible says to think on whatsoever is good and right and true, yet they preach the crucifiction. The Bible says not to make a likeness of anything in heaven or on earth, of a god or creation and bow down and worship it, yet the church idolizes and glorifies the cross and the crucifixion of Jesus. I found it repulsive. Jesus said that the truth would make you free, yet the church creates rules and doctrine to keep people obedient to their authority.
So how then do we get this power that Jesus promised? I recommend reading Jesus Taught It Too (The Early Roots Of The Law Of Attraction) by Philip F Harris and The Writings of Florence Scovel Shinn. These writings really helped me to see how Jesus taught this stuff and how to apply the knowledge. It definately requires shedding old beliefs and learning new ones. Even the disciples didn't understand what Jesus taught, as He said so and then explained it to them several times in the Bible.
Many of the things that Jesus taught have to do with our thoughts and beliefs and how they affect our lives. In the terms we use here on IQ, we would say that our thoughts and beliefs affect our vibration which affects our perception of reality. Jesus taught people to do things that raise their vibration and not things that lower it. For example, Jesus said that the Law said not to kill, yet if you think about killing your brother, it is the same as killing him. I didn't understand that from a physical perspective, but if you see that thinking about killing your brother, it puts you in the same vibration as if you did kill him, then it makes sense.
answered 23 May '13, 10:33
love the way you put it ♫ ♣ ♥♫ ♦♫ ♣ ♥♫ ♥♫ ♦ ♫
(23 May '13, 10:44) ru bis
Thanks ru bis!
(23 May '13, 11:21) Fairy Princess
Excellent answer and by the way he did mean faith can move real mountains. To back it up I turn to the Buddha that said, "A monk highly skilled in concentration can crack a mountain in half."
(23 May '13, 14:26) Wade Casaldi
If a monk that has that kind of ability can crack a mountain in half, do you just suppose that maybe he has mountain splitting faith?
Everything is energy, now to quote Yoda when he told Luke to use The Force to lift the X-wing fighter from the swamp. Luke said it is too big and heavy. Yoda replied "It is only big and heavy in your belief. Big and heavy or small and light, no difference."
(23 May '13, 14:26) Wade Casaldi
showing 2 of 4 show 2 more comments
Absolutely YES! The bible is a book of mythology that was recorded by primitive men about a family linage, interpreted by primitive men and then bound together like a bunch of comic books and then a business model (church) built around it. Why would you bind yourself to such primitive interpretation of the world around you? Why would you bind yourself to such a primitive limited interpretation of spirit and God? God is bigger than the bible. Jesus is bigger than the bible. Lucifer, if he exists, is bigger than the bible (by the way Islam does not look at Lucifer as a fallen angel or evil). YOU are bigger than the bible. Do not limit yourself by other's beliefs or human interpretations that are trying to guilt you into God and the Bible. You feel there is more and there is. There is no evil in the world, only the corruption of the human spirit by generations of confusion. You are breaking the chain of confusion. It will feel strange at first because you are re-creating yourself and the framework or lens in which you view the world...in other words you are now realizing that you have been creating your own reality all along.
If you are afraid then you need to ask yourself why you are afraid? Why do you feel you need to believe in a vengeful limited God as written by primitive people and translated and re-translated again and again instrument designed by the church for control of the population and resource acquisition at the expense of entire races of people.
Does it make sense that all loving, omnipresent, all powerful God would limit himself to favor only part of his creation at the exclusion of all others. Does it make sense that God gave you and Adam free will and in his perfection would make and destroy you and this world out of anger for using that free will? Ask any uncorrupted child if he should be punished for Adam's deeds and he will tell you NO it doesn't make any sense. He was born innocent. Corrupt the child with the guilt and fear of religion and you get another lost soul trying to find his way back to love for the rest of his life.
The only good stuff to recall from the bible are the words of Jesus. The kingdom of heaven is within YOU. Your emotional guidance will lead you there. Stand where you are an look around you. Everything within your view is perceived good or bad by your mood and your translation. Good or Bad is a label. Remove the labels. Experiment for one day and pretend that every thing you see is something that you caused to be in your view. You can recognize the contrast as feelings: I feel good and I feel uncomfortable or "bad". Acknowledge "this makes me feel good, I like it", and "I am looking at this it makes me feel bad, I feel good that I can learn from it now. How would I need to think about this to not be afraid?" Throw everything you have been trained to believe out the door and see how this feels for one day.
You are not alone. Look at the stars in the night sky and know this. You are source, you choose to create the reality you desire...with the bible or without it. You are doing it every now that you have lived.
answered 20 Jun '13, 20:54
Thank you very much @atlanta... it helps a lot... very much.
(21 Jun '13, 04:31) Romel
@atalanta many thing you say are in truth about human and what they did. but why judge them? they did the best they could with the understanding they add. I am sure that you would not like to be judge by other people in the future as being primitive, Would you? to the measure you judge also will you be judge. They will do the same. as for the part about fear God. If I would say to you that you make your choice. and that nothing is hidden in the kingdom of heaven.
(21 Jun '13, 22:54) white tiger
And until you are at peace with your self and other you cannot enter the kingdom. Jesus was telling the truth. Blessed are the peacemakers they will be called sons of God. so you see that it is not as being afraid of God. The problem is not God. The problem is the division in you. That makes you judge your self and other rather then accept the truth. If you are not able to live with the truth, What will you do? How do you expect to be set free? Are you with out sin to cast the first stone?
(21 Jun '13, 23:00) white tiger
I have just told you the truth, how are you living with it? Who do you want to blame or judge? Will it add to your stature? Do you need someone to praise you? If I am telling you that God is not the one doing those things to you but you are doing it to yourself out of your free will, and you do not know it. When you will be lead by the spirit in to the desert and be born of water and spirit and go above to the kingdom you will know that I was telling you the truth. I am the way the truth and-
(21 Jun '13, 23:07) white tiger
the life. A little child of seven days just told you this so that you might find the place of life.
(21 Jun '13, 23:09) white tiger
@white tiger I truly hope that future mankind sees us as primitive. That their mindset has drastically changed from what it is today. That brother don't kill brothers . That greed is a considered a folly and that truth between everyone is their ultimate goal... Please pray that mankind advances in 3000 years so much that we ARE considered primitive.
(22 Jun '13, 04:05) ursixx
I truly hope that future mankind a decade from now sees us as primitive. Much like [some of] we [us] look back and frown upon much of the behavior of even our current established 'norm' for human interactions, I hope in a short time we will look back and laugh at things which will become common sense, like the truths you listed.
Why should it take millennia to accept and understand truths wise men and prophets have been teaching since the dawn of time? I'm embarrassed we still haven't got it.
(22 Jun '13, 05:12) Snow
@white tiger chill out dude. They are primitive...that is a statement of fact. The bible is made up of many books by many different writers which initial intent was to capture the mythology of a particular lineage of people on this planet of many peoples and state why they are "chosen". Just like you would tell the lineage of any family and justify why they are special among many. WE do not have to subjugate ourselves to this particular story.We create our own reality and our own story.
(23 Jun '13, 13:33) atalanta
The Romans, who were quite resourceful, built a business model around this book and the rest of the people of the planet fell for it. You are free. You don't have to keep quoting your version of the bible to everyone. Everyone has the will to make their own choices. So White Tiger...just chill. The kingdom is here in the NOW. You don't have to go anywhere or wait until you die...it's here right NOW. NOW.
(23 Jun '13, 13:40) atalanta
What is sad is that "spiritually" man hasn't changed much over the last 3000 years, particularly because of the retardation of the advancement of the human spirit caused the death grip of the Christian churches. Jesus did not want you to get caught up in his death on the cross. He wanted you to learn from his actions while he was alive...that you could be just like him.
(23 Jun '13, 13:44) atalanta
@atlanta if you are not born of water and the spirit you cannot enter the kingdom. in this world you are a passer-by. The kingdom is above. when you will be just like Jesus you shall also be just like me. Because we know the kingdom and know the one that sent us. God is omnipotent and know all from the beginning to the end. why I know this is because I asked him for the meaning of all this and he showed it to me in full. And I know why he is God. I have understand the difference between the
(14 Jul '13, 11:00) white tiger
father and the sons in the kingdom. yet we do not make a division because of this. each of us is unique and we are all equal in the kingdom blessed are the peacemakers.
(14 Jul '13, 11:09) white tiger
Why is everyone here hooked on "fearing the Lord?" Why do you need to FEAR your "creator"? Why would your creator want you to FEAR him/her/it? This makes no sense at all to FEAR the Lord. That's mid-evil bull that was written in the bible to keep you peasants from revolting. Looking at the bible out of context of the history it was written in is looking at a fish out of water.
(14 Jul '13, 12:10) atalanta
because it is the beginning of wisdom if you do not fear anything how many error are you going to do? you will use improper measure that are not in truth and harm your self and other. And to the measure you judge also will you be judge. For the moment in this world many are clean only on the outside but inside they are full of division and darkness. And the darkness cannot stand in the light for fear that it will be reveal and destroy. Look right now you judge that we are peasant that cannot-
(14 Jul '13, 13:13) white tiger
revolt. Who do you want to revolt against? Why are you rebellious? Will any of this help you to better your self? Why do you carry this darkness with you? Why do you want to praise your self over other? I do not fear the lord because I Know him, up above. I am not the one that will judge you, the word that I have spoke is what will judge you. And the word is truth.
(14 Jul '13, 13:23) white tiger
did I judge you? did I speak more then I have to praise my self over you? or did I tell you the truth? I judge you not repent go and sin no more.
(14 Jul '13, 14:20) white tiger
Fear=wisdom is not what is taught by Buddah. Only in this fabricated Christianity (of Today) is fear the most prominent feeling you are "supposed to have" or you are NOT considered to be enlightened or open to Infinite Wisdom. It is not. Happiness and joy will lead you from the darkness. Continued next comment....
(14 Jul '13, 14:22) atalanta
continued... Fear is only there to tell you that you have touched the darkness and that there is something to learn from it. By asking what you have to learn from the fear you will open yourself to the light.Be happy and wait for an answer. You will receive it because you are happy in your now, not because you are afraid. Shuddering in fear will keep you from the answer.
(14 Jul '13, 14:22) atalanta
@white tiger "did I judge you did I speak more then I have to praise my self over you or did I tell you the truth. I judge you not repent go and sin no more." What is this? Dude lighten up! :P Get off your high and mighty horse. You're scaring the kiddies. They'll be looking for sins all day long instead of being happy they can touch the trees and smell the breeze.
(14 Jul '13, 14:29) atalanta
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vri5DSCpe5Y Listen to this.
(14 Jul '13, 14:36) atalanta
atlanta, back to fear statement, the eyes of the heart see the wonder of variety, the limited brain-mind often sees but fear. a reason to respect thinking
(14 Jul '13, 17:23) fred
@atalanta, the answers box should only be used to provide answers to the original question and is not intended for making comments. Please do not answer multiple times per question. If you wish to make a comment on an existing answer, your own answer, or to existing comments, please click on the "Add New Comment" link available under each answer. Thanks. I'm converting your "answer" into a comment.
(15 Jul '13, 11:50) Barry Allen ♦♦
@atalanta if you fear it is because you are in ignorance. Then you will seek wisdom and knowledge in truth to not stay in fear. then fear is the beginning of wisdom. Did not Buddha teach about ignorance? you can read your self: BUDDHA TEACHING : The cause of suffering The Buddha explained that people live in a sea of suffering because of ignorance and greed.
(23 Jul '13, 03:07) white tiger
They are ignorant of the law of karma and are greedy for the wrong kind of pleasures. They do things that are harmful to their bodies and peace of mind, so they can not be satisfied or enjoy life. http://www.himalayanmart.com/buddhateaching/buddhateaching.php
(23 Jul '13, 03:13) white tiger
showing 3 of 24 show 21 more comments
Your fine Romel. The Father within you, that is you , is beginning to awaken.
The process cannot be stopped or reversed. Its quite normal and natural. You will never again be able to accept the rubbish thats preached in the name of so called christianity again. It will become more and more unpallatable to you.
You will not outgrow the teachings of the bible, you will see new teachings within its pages. You will begin to see the 4 th dimensional truths contained within those writings.
There will soon be not one stone standing on another as far as your old beliefs are concerned.
Rejoice, you will soon have "THE" revelation "OF"Christ. Not the Christ taught to you in church but the real on. The one thats always been you, even before you came into this body.
answered 22 May '13, 14:02
Thank you for the reassurance sir @Monty Riviera. Last night in my bed before I go to sleep, that fear in me fade away. It vanished to thin air with out any reason, it simply goes without me thinking or dealing on it. I feel great this morning and everything felt so light...
(22 May '13, 20:32) Romel
I have the same inner conflicts that you do in regards to being Christian and being "enlightened", too.
It is possible to have your cake and eat it, too! How?
You have NOT outgrown your Bible- rather, you need to dig deeper into it, to find that hidden treasures it contains that will tell you that Christ, too, was enlightened. "I am the way, the Truth, and the Life," he said. What is He saying? Do as I do. Be as I am. Then you, too, will find "it". Check out this post. It was part of my ongoing visions about God, heaven, and Christ.
Jesus just trying to teach us that we could be like Him if we did what He did. He latched onto something Really Big. You'll see that He was desperate to get us to have deep and total Faith. Spiritual Faith.
Please look at the Bible differently. It is like a big toolkit. Inside are treasures to find that speak of truths that apply, no matter what spiritual background you have. Some people are afraid of the Bible. They think that it is only for Christians. No! It is enormously valuable, if you apply its hidden truths to your life.
A guy named Bill Wilson, in 1935, took the pure essence of the spiritual truths of the Bible and other vastly important spiritual books (like those by Emmet Fox and C.S, Lewis), and distilled their ideas down into a plan to help people with addictions. He was enormously successful, and millions of people have benefited from this book. What is it? The book is called Alcoholics Anonymous, and within it lies the secret that has helped hopeless drunks become sober and straight. We never say that we have "outgrown" AA. It just gets deeper and deeper. The same with the Bible.
I have a very bad headache and need to lie down, but I just had to write to you and tell you that one never outgrows any good spiritual book of Truth. Rather, we grow, and see it anew with more mature eyes every time we grow. It does not stop. It does not lose its truths.
answered 23 May '13, 00:48
I also think Jesus would warn not every quote attributed to the divine is in fact from the supposed source. And if you were to look inside yourself and genuinely ask your heart and mind you'd be able to find the truth beneath any misdirection man had put to hinder us from finding it.
A religion that is true will not indoctrinate but instead encourage an unyielding search for truth. The real truth cannot be shaken, by science or spirit or anywhere in between.. that's the nature of truth. ^_^y
(23 May '13, 00:57) Snow
@Snow- True, true! The truth is the Truth. It stands absolute and cannot be shaken by anyone. Excellent point! Jai
(23 May '13, 01:12) Jaianniah
Thanks Jai and Snow... Yes, I start to see it now, I am blessed by your answers and to sir Wade too. You three are real. I say now I am a real Christian, not bound by specific indoctrination of a group. I was a Christian before, the so called Oneness (do not believe in Holy trinity), that thinks that Trinitarian Christians are bound to hell, much more non-Christians. But now I am more open and understand that no denomination or doctrine can monopolize the truth. Thank you very much.
(23 May '13, 04:24) Romel
I pray you get rid of that headache ma'am Jai. Blessings to you too.
(23 May '13, 04:25) Romel
Love Stairway to Heaven
(29 Jul '13, 04:31) ele
showing 2 of 5 show 3 more comments
I am telling you the truth, I will make it simple for you to understand: God created man in is image. Blessed are the peacemaker they will be called sons of God. it is written in your bible is it not? If every one is at peace with each other are they not equal even if they are different? You cannot be equal to God in the sense to be exactly like him, but as a child of God you are like him. compare a father to a child on this earth the child is made in the image of is father yet he needs to grow and he is not the father. Satan did not want equality with God he wanted to be superior to God. How can he be superior if it makes division and end the peace ? that is why he cannot be in the kingdom. Adam and eve took the fruit of division you know the rest of the story. Since then men are trap in their sin judging other complaining making inequity. you should not be surprise at my saying. the one that serve you best is the greatest among you, and he does not need to be superior to any one else.
answered 23 May '13, 19:40
Thanks @white tiger for the reply, it makes more sense now and more clear... I am truly enlightened by your answer.
(24 May '13, 06:22) Romel
@Romel you say that I have enlighten you.
(24 May '13, 12:51) white tiger
Enlightenment is more than just the big Buddah (I know everything) enlightenment. It is also new clarity and understanding. Like the Zen Koens every time it says "He was enlightened" doesn't mean he now understands all that is. It means for that subject he is out of the darkness of not understanding. :-)
(24 May '13, 13:08) Wade Casaldi
we speak of what we know and testify to what we have seen. Do not be surprise at my saying.
(24 May '13, 14:09) white tiger
Yes I agree with both your answer and comment. +1 from me. :-)
(24 May '13, 14:39) Wade Casaldi
The wind blows where it wishes and you hear the sound of it, but do not know where it comes from and where it is going; so is everyone who is born of the Spirit.
(24 May '13, 14:55) white tiger
@white tiger. Satan did not want to be superior to God. In Islam Satan did not want to bow down to God's creation, Man. This is very different than your interpretation. In otherwords, Satan as spirit, as Source, because Satan was also created by Source did not want to bow down to God's meat machine, Man. Satan did not want to be like man...because he was Source. The bible is a historical document only in that it is a telling of stories by people with incomplete understanding about what their family lineage is. The story of Eden is when Man first stood up and realized he can have what he wants across the valley...fresh fruit that he saw the pig and the snake eat. Your understanding seems to be colored by the separation of God, Satan and Man as separate instead of all being different expressions of Source. Now White Tiger, it is your free will to believe what you wish, as you are the creator of your own reality. It is all of our free will to determine if what you are expressing here makes sense as "is it logical?" I know that your interpretation is off. I know because I AM. The peace did not simply end because of a "fall" of a particular creation of Source but because man decided to loath himself and all that he is that Source created. This happened generation over generation. When Man decided to loath his own body which is the image of God, Man separated himself from God. Man deemed himself unworthy because he appears more like animal than what he believes God to be. Man IS God's image. Go look in the mirror and look into the eyes of God. You are he and he is you. There is no evil, there is no Satan as you describe. There is only illusion which you seem to be caught up in.
(06 Jul '13, 18:19) atalanta
@atalanta, the answers box should only be used to provide answers to the original question and is not intended for making comments. If you wish to make a comment on an existing answer or to existing comments, please click on the "Add New Comment" link available under each answer. Thanks. I'm converting your "answer" into a comment.
(06 Jul '13, 19:04) Barry Allen ♦♦
@atalanta first of all you assume and judge that my understanding is colored by the separation from God. but I am in God and God is in me. I know the one that sent me. and I know where I come from and where I am going. I will also tell you this that Satan is divided because of is jealousy of men or God. it does not change the fact that he is divided and not at peace with him self and other. we are created in the image of God as spirit. That Satan cannot accept it is not the fault of God or is-
(06 Jul '13, 20:35) white tiger
sons. As for men they are divided of the kingdom and they do not know where they come from or where they are going. And they are blind in their heart and mind, they wash the outside of the cup and not the inside. And they cannot accept the truth. If they would accept the truth they would be set free. And would be at peace with them self and other. You have free will and are responsible of it. I am telling you the truth and you are not in the darkness any more. Let there be light,Be the light-
(06 Jul '13, 20:44) white tiger
that you can be, experience and enjoy.
(06 Jul '13, 20:44) white tiger
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9R5VwxvUUvI meditate and reflect. when you lift up the son of man that you are and ascend as spirit. you will be set free and know that I am he. But for now you cannot do it. and you do not know where you come from and where you are going. who ever does not respect the son does not respect the father that sent him. if you judge that my understanding is colored. because you say that Satan did not accept men and respect them. but I say to you that God made us in is -
(06 Jul '13, 21:30) white tiger
image.God is spirit. if he does not respect the father he will not respect the son also. if he would have respect the father he would have respect the son. yet you judge that my understanding is colored. and you seek only the body the flesh even if you know that it will pass away. And you will not drink the water that I have gave you. out of your own choice so do not blame me.
(06 Jul '13, 21:34) white tiger
showing 3 of 13 show 10 more comments
Some (so called) Christian beliefs were meant to crumble.
Some (so called) Christians hold firmly to the notion that this one book, and only this one book, is absolute authority of God's Word. So, the book possibly, I would say probably, becomes that which replaces the experience of God's Word.
Some (so called) Christians are convinced it is the Father who throws the Child into hell for disobedience. So, when confronted with temptation or tragedy on earth, they project onto God (really judge God), that the Creator has caused this, and/or is testing me.
Some (so called) Christians somehow hold to idea that if God didn't say it in the bible, then what is being attributed to God can't be Divine, for otherwise, it would've been included in the bible. This creates a wonderful loophole to establish 'false teachings' and thus limit God. Of course, no Christian is going to admit to limiting God, so perhaps another way of saying this is 'limit one's self on journey back to God.'
Any of us who have strayed from traditional / orthodox teaching, and found Truth in messages that are all around us, have experienced (I believe) a crumbling of beliefs. I think of this as a period of 'sorting out.' During that sorting out phase, it is quite possible that the baby gets tossed with the bathwater, and thus Christian faith is abandoned. And as there are alternate views / explanations for most of what's in the bible, it can be abandoned for good. Even while the Truth remains, and the path continues.
I find it plausible to review the bible, approach it with discernment, and honor it for its profound wisdom. Though I am one who reinterprets certain passages in ways that seem incredibly obvious to me, while to others, it is either not obvious or possibly blasphemous.
As in example of "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father, except through me." If this were actually about Jesus (as sole Christ), I'd have to see that as Jesus saying, "I, Jesus, am the way....." But that's not said. Instead it is a statement about "me" (and you, or all of us). This interpretation takes nothing away from the message, and unlike the common interpretation, doesn't add to it (not adding Jesus in there, when even Jesus didn't add it in there). Thus, all of us can say, and it is Truth, "I am the way, the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father, except through me." To know the Father, or return to God, you must go through you. To think you must go through another, or through a holy book, is what I would deem blasphemous. Also helps, I think, if you realize Christ Self is in all. As Jesus apparently knew this, his example appears more perfect, but in reality, for you to identify the Christ in Jesus, you must see Christ in own Self. How anyone pretends to know Christ and deny it in own self always baffles me. And on my more peaceful days, it actually humors me. Who said orthodox Christians don't have a sense of humor?
answered 22 Jul '13, 14:41
Wow that was beautiful! Jesus ment for all of us to be like him and that our physical self and spiritual self are the ME, the WE, the Way. Realizing that this duality of physical and spiritual is a unique perspective that allows for continual growth in both. The keys to heaven are within you. You have the power to bring heaven to earth by saving yourself from the confusion that this constructed reality brings.
(22 Jul '13, 18:10) atalanta
@Juan I agree with you that many son of man in this world blame God for everything but they have free will. They also will said Jesus was killed to save our self from sin. Is that the truth? If it was the truth they would not sin any more They would have solved their division would be peacemakers with a pure heart in truth would have overcome and went above. They are still blind they make war,lie praise them self and judge other. I do not agree with you on I am the way the truth and the life.-
(22 Jul '13, 20:15) white tiger
Only one that has overcome and know the place of life can tell you this. The one that did not overcome and went above cannot know the way the truth and the life. If you are looking for someone to get you somewhere that you never have been would you not take someone that know the way? or would you take someone that as not been there to give you direction? Do you want to know the way to get to the truth and the place of life? Or do you want the lie to get you to the place of death?
(22 Jul '13, 20:20) white tiger
I agree with you that the choice and the walk is your responsibility. a little child of seven days just told you that so that you may find the place of life.
(22 Jul '13, 20:23) white tiger
jman, perhaps the original intent wqas to let it be know that 'the christ' in us all is the way to(wards) the Light
(22 Jul '13, 21:11) fred
@fred very good solve your own inner division in you to be born of water then learn from the living one in you that is spirit and light to solve your last division and become one, born of spirit. then overcome cross the last narrow gate and go above to the kingdom. then you will know the glory of the living Christ in you. you will know where you come from and where you are going.
(12 Sep '13, 06:46) white tiger
showing 2 of 6 show 4 more comments
Spirituality is a question that I have been striving to answer for the last 30 years of my 55 yrs existence on this planet. I was brought up in a very strict catholic country where the religion not only controlled the church but the government. This has now changed and the result of been controlled that much by a religious body was fear and guilt because it portrayed God as SOMEONE you should fear, when in actual fact it was a way of the religious organisation using God to control you for their benefit and control. The harm that this done certainly to me, was to look at God and Jesus as something to be feared, and fear destroys. I can not read the bible without these fears rising and therefore can't use the bible as part of my spirituality teaching which is a deep regret. I have come to the conclusion that spirituality comes from a place deep within yourself, not something that comes from outside influences. If you take the bible put it through a religious body who dissect it for their own benefit , what you get is a loss of respect for the bible and its teachings. This should not be the way. Now the bible becomes fearful instead of something you should refer to as part of your own spirituality. This has led to many religious wars. I have also looked at other religions and find some solace from Hinduism, Buddhism and even the law of attraction.
answered 12 Sep '13, 05:52
laucan, the hand me down translation by less spiritual scholars of the original words left to help explain to mankind how he arrived on earth and what his destiny is has become more remiss over the years. yet your observation of how those who taught of having the keys to heaven often propagate fear and dependence to remain in control of your soul and purse. there is much knowledge now on the internet to be explored. may your search for the truth be rewarding
(12 Sep '13, 16:06) fred
Thanks Fred, my search goes on.
(12 Sep '13, 17:12) Laucan
showing 2 of 3 show 1 more comments
Yes, Romel I believe you can because -
You are growing more spiritual and it's only natural you would wish to explore & experience for yourself.
... and as @White Tiger says
This answer is marked "community wiki".
answered 26 Sep '13, 07:18
Wonderful opening description of your journey, I can relate to it completely. Some things that I have found helpful recently. "Christianity is the religion about Jesus, not the religion OF Jesus". So sad but so true.
I've never been able to reconcile the notion of an omnipotent God. Just this weekend, I found out why. There is no omnipotent God. However, God did reveal to me this insight, that brings me just one inch closer to He/She/God, for lack of a better word, Him.
"There are things beyond God’s power; and yet, there are things that can only come from God."
After a year of separation from church, I'm starting to read my Bible again, and understand better what Christ meant when he taught us, that if we obey his teachings, we shall know the truth, and the truth shall set us free.
The church teaches us to believe, but Jesus taught us to obey. As a UU minister recently put it: "Real religion is not one that is believed; real religion is one that is practiced."
Getting back to your question about Lucifer's sin, of equating himself to God:
My year in the wilderness brought me back to where I started, but now I understand that I am truly nothing compared to the vastness of God. I'm but a small part of all those spirits across a universe of existence.
Being humble is a must to moving forward with any meaning. The true meaning of Proverbs 9:10 opened up for me like a hidden treasure: "The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom." We'll never make any progress if we think we are anything other than our true selves, our very imperfect, and fallen selves.
We must start with knowing our place, with being humble. This is the only starting point that will lead us to God. Gandhi said it best: "The seeker of truth must be so humble, that the dust could crush him.".
Now I understand.
answered 14 Jul '13, 09:03
I am telling you the truth verily verily everything's comes from God from the beginning to the end. God is omnipotent and know all. God is spirit. is worshipper most worship him in spirit and truth. there is no small part in the kingdom all are spirit made in the image of the father. all are unique and special.
(14 Jul '13, 11:20) white tiger
dale, he agrees that there isn't a personal god but that the elohim followed through with their given design to fashion the form that would become the purist material temple for the spirit of man to experience and evolve into a fully self conscious manus
(14 Jul '13, 17:17) fred
"[...] I am (or more precisely WAS) a closed minded Christian [...]"
We talk about being 'open minded' and 'closed minded' (and 'narrow minded'), but maybe it's being 'minded' at all that keeps people 'searching for the Truth'. Brings to mind (no pun intended) the picture of the mule and the carrot (or the dog running after his own tail). And believe me, I've spent about 35 years doing the exact same thing, but 'once I was lost, but now I'm found' and I couldn't tell you (nor me) who found me :-)
Come to think of it, 'Abraham' (not the one from the bible) stated in one of his/her/their movies: "You can't go there from there'. The deeper meaning of which might be: "You can't KNOW anything, as long as you remain you".
answered 30 Jul '13, 04:58
you say: "You can't KNOW anything, as long as you remain you". well I say to you: "You can't KNOW anything, unless you became you. the real you not the false one that society try to make you believe that you are. since you did not find that out yet you cannot see it nor understand it. the dead are not alive and the living will not die. when you become 2 what will you do? We speak about what we know and report what we have seen. The dust return to the dust and the light to the light.
(30 Jul '13, 19:37) white tiger
Find a place to rest before you become a carcass. clean the inside of the cup walk on your own water and solve your duality and inner division. Let the spirit lead you in to all truth, be the light that you can be Strive to Enter the straight gate, find that narrow door. Go above to the place of life everlasting. Where God is the light of the kingdom. I am the way the truth and the life.
(30 Jul '13, 19:45) white tiger
You're a true poet, white tiger, and so your concepts are a bit different than mine and others. That's just the point: we're making it all up, tweaking existing theories, making up different stories about life and everything about it. There is no truth, other than the one you believe in. It's as simple as that, but that's just my opinion. who's to tell? Cheers
(31 Jul '13, 02:53) ronald123
@ronald123 you call me a poet, I do not consider my self a poet. my concept as you say are the truth when you have lifted up the son of men that you are and go above, and see all the children and the father in all their glory in the kingdom above you will know that I am he that is speaking to you.
(12 Sep '13, 06:25) white tiger
showing 2 of 4 show 2 more comments
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"can one outgrow the teachings of the bible?" @Romel, after reading what you've just said it seems clear that you already have
@ru bis I need to add more lines to make myself clear why I am asking this.
I already added the two paragraphs (2nd and third from the bottom)
@Romel - "Lucifer fall when he made himself like the Most High. Isn't it that the teachings that we being co-creators...equate ourselves to the Most High?" - I think the key difference is that Lucifer preached opposition to source as a means to power, whereas Christ (and many metaphysical teachers) preached connection to source as a means to happiness, and, for lack of a better term, "power." In my own experience I can say that "opposition to source" doesn't work too well. :)
@Romel - More thoughts on this subject here: http://www.inwardquest.com/questions/66009/law-of-attraction-karma-and-sitting-in-the-dark-on-a-sunny-day/66444
@lozenge123... Though my feeling of fear for it disappears this morning, I still wan't to understand deeper into this. My purpose to come here at IQ is simple, that is to learn the Law of Attraction so that I can manifest financial abundance. That is my humble purpose of coming here. But I found something more, something big, and it is the big that I am more excited. So I pursue it and I am on it now. Thanks for the link, I am reading it now.
what we outgrow is the false interpretation of scripture, learning that our journey to light is not so much the words spoken or to obediently follow dogma rather to perceive the spiritual
if a cup is dirty inside and is stuck on the ground how can it purify it self? let me tell you of the parable of the cup. there was a cup stuck on the ground is water was dirty yet it was trying to cover it self in the darkness thinking no one will drink from me. yet one day it was not hiding because it was looking for the truth to clean it self. and looking for pure everlasting water. then it started to rain for many days the water in the cup became a spring and the dirt was push out in-
understanding and truth. then the light came and with the pure water in the cup the cup saw the light on the water and the light saw its on reflection on the water they shared together for over 40 days to solve their own division until booth water and light became one and it ascended above leaving the cup made of clay on the earth.the water and the light out of its own choice came back down in the cup. This is for those who have eyes to see and ears to hear. we speak of what we know and report-
what we have seen. But if you do not believe me when I tell you of things of this world how will you ever believe me when I speak to you of things above. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tbBmpaDBizA (4) Jesus said, "The man old in days will not hesitate to ask a small child seven days old about the place of life, and he will live. For many who are first will become last, and they will become one and the same." I am he that speak to you,so that you find the place of life.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bLaRVEZqqRc as Nathanael saw the light that he is when is cup was wash with pure water. and Jesus told him what he would see once born of the spirit. a true isrealite. as Israel was pure of heart and ascended to God. Did you saw it? Happy is the man who comes to him self and awakens. Blessed is he who open the eyes of the blind.
born of water nothing false in him everything in truth. born of spirit the water and the light become one. overcome and ascend above to the kingdom and to God. Israelite is not about the nation. it is about the man Israel the one with clean hand and a pure heart that saw God. Eventually people will know this and stop to fight about race and stop praising them self for their own ego. And praise the one that sent them, In spirit and in truth.
I am telling you the truth many will not be able to overcome. because they cannot deny them self do not be surprise at my saying. Where would the cup water go when it is broken and return to dust if there is no light in it? I do not ask that any one be taken out of the world by braking their cup. Yet they all have the choice to be born of water and spirit and be the light that they can be.
one day you will understand the mystery of the little pearl. and you will understand the mystery of the golden transparent street. and the mystery of the 12 gates that the pearl are. and the kingdom of God where God and the lamb are the light and the kingdom there. But if I speak of earthly things and you do not believe me, how will you ever believe me if I talk to you of heavenly things?
I find the Lucifer story to be lacking significant details and easy to scapegoat a brother for things like temptation, hatred and envy. There are other tales of Lucifer that paint him in neutral light or even a good light. IMO, none of that matters to own path / salvation. It works as a metaphor and nothing more. If you have outgrown the tale of Lucifer as overlord of evil, then I'd call that a good thing. Means you are open minded and recognize true responsibility for own beliefs, and truth.