I was thinking about the quote: "Destiny Is Not A Matter of Chance, It Is A Matter Of Choice." When I read this quote from my silver coins (I have two silver coins, yay investing! I also invested in some stocks, but regret that because it will make next years taxes more complex.)... when I read the quote to my sister she said that the quote was the same thing as there being no destiny.

There seems to a scale in history where we slid from the 'life is a matter of fate' to 'life is a matter of choice.' Now the Law of Attraction seems to be on the matter of the choice end of the spectrum, but Alan Watts argued it in another way. He said that we are not victims of life with things just happening to us and we are not making everything happen. Yet at the same time, we were both victims of life/circumstance and we were making everything happen. (Sorry to paraphrase, but it was a lengthy lecture.) He concluded that these are two sides of the same coin and based on the wrong question. Listen to Essential Listening from the Alan Watts Archive Lecture series titled: 'Out of Your Mind.' Because right now I cannot remember what the question was. (Edit: I think the question was 'Who am I?' and the ways it was answered.)

I was wondering what your two cents on the topic were. Perhaps Abraham would speak of the power of intention, and being a deliberate creator. However, doesn't the Law of Attraction also somewhat weigh in on the fate side as even if you are intending something if your vibration does not match the intention you will manifest something else. Also, there is the whole contrast element where sometimes you manifest something not to your liking to provide the contrast to desire something more.

Even today there are belief systems that use the fate concept and taken in the right context it can feel empowering. The relief of not having to control and worry about every single detail and watch every thought! Taken that way the idea of fate feels good, yet when fate makes you feel like a victim of circumstance is very weighty and being a manifestor feels good.

One of my spiritual teachers, Matt Kahn, said that things are a matter of destiny, but you have a choice of how you will experience the destiny. Again this is a paraphrase.

asked 13 May '18, 12:55

Igot7's gravatar image


edited 13 May '18, 14:41

Everything is your choice- including destiny.

In order to experience anything in particular, it is good to limit yourself in some way- like a painter who choses to use only blue colors for a certain painting, to see what he can do with it. That's what you did before your birth, when you were still a shapeless blob of consciousness- you chose the limitation of being human in order to experience yourself as such. You also set up for yourself, together with your very loving conglomerate of friendly blobs (your soul family), various challenges and issues to serve as a general framework for your upcoming life.

That's the destiny part. You chose it- you just don't remember. And for good reason- if you did, you couldn't experience it, because you'd already know. You you kept a part of yourself- commonly known as your high self or your inner being- outside of the space time framework in order to guide your through your life in the most rewarding way.

Within that- you have a huge amount of leeway to fill in the details in any way you like- on a whim, or many whims, any way you chose. You can even reject your life's purpose- but I recommend not to do that, because it generally feels gloomy. Ecstatic joy is much nicer, which is what you get as a reward for embracing your challenges- the ones that you, acting as your own destiny, set up for yourself. But the details- go wild, surprise yourself, go for anything you like. That's where the manifesting comes in- have fun with it! You'll gravitate towards manifesting your life's purpose in do time.

For example, I recently happened across a whole lot of money and quit my job. What did I do, after taking about a month off? I went back to programming. Well, guess I'm a techie- I just love doing that. But now I do it on my own terms and I now nobody's forcing me. Fun. Guess my life's purpose has something to do with programming- but what? Music software? Cryptocurrencies? Some kind of app? Who knows!!! How exciting, guess I'll find out as I keep working on my beliefs and imagine stuff that's exciting to me. I also have all kinds of fun stuff going on in my life that have nothing to do with programming- relationships, love, family- those are partially part of my life's work and partially fanciful detail as well. The mix of it makes it all so worthwhile.

The thing to keep in mind- destiny manifests by what you want, not things that are imposed on you- although that may be relative to stuff that happened.



answered 16 May '18, 09:31

cmc's gravatar image


Ah, this is where it gets a bit complicated. At least in my opinion.

First, I tend to agree with your teacher's view - there is some thing like a „destiny" and ultimately you should not be able to change the „predestined" end result of your life. The thing that you can change is your life's path to that end result. There are probably infinitely many paths that will eventually lead to you fulfilling your „destiny".

This is something that Bashar tells us to, if I am not mistaken. He speaks of „life themes" - Everyone has a life theme he/she needs to fulfill in this life. For example, someone needs to experience loss of an arm or a leg in his life and there is no way around it. But how one comes to lose an arm or a leg is up to that someone. One can lose an arm in a car accident, while chopping wood, by a serial killer attack, etc.

Possibly one evidence of there being a destiny is one's state when born. What I mean by this is the fact that some people are born rich and some poor, some are born with incurable diseases and some healthy, some as European and some as Asian, etc. That „starting position" is actually of great significance and can, and possibly will, determine and direct one's route in life to ultimately fulfilling one's destiny.

Second, there is this thing called Law of Attration. And if you ask me, LOA and destiny should contradict each other. I mean, how can one be able to fully control one's life but at the same time not fully be able to control it, right? Still, one can come up with several arguments that can possibly explain this situation. I'll state just a couple off the top of my head: 1. all works in perfect harmony and we just can't really fully grasp and know the nature of the universe. Like trying to teach an ant Marx's historical materialism. 2. to change your destiny is actually possible but not probable. Possible because of the LOA but not probable because of apparent „agreements", rules for playing this game of life on Earth, we made before incarnating on Earth(as told by Bashar).

My two cents


answered 13 May '18, 15:44

Marin's gravatar image


Nobody's a victim, but they are always match for what they "are" vibrationally. You know how "you are" by what you feel about circumstances in your life.

My perspective, based on my own experience, is that we only know how we feel---what vibration was hidden from conscious awareness---when something happens. You can go around talking about that there's really no such thing as death, and then someone you love dies, and you find yourself in grief. So that tells you that you DO actually believe that there is a such thing as death, and it's super painful for you. Now, how would you ever know that, and get the opportunity to transcend that, without actually experiencing death? You experienced "death" because you contained the vibration of it, and it's a negative vibration. Someone whose belief system contained the idea of death but it was positive, would have a very different experience. And someone whose belief system didn't even include the concept of death would have a still more different experience (that I can't imagine because so far my belief system includes death). There's no "destiny" as in predetermined fate...there is just "who you are." And you know who you are, by how you feel.

My life is astonishingly good in most areas. I'm financially wealthy, I have mostly great relationships, both platonic and romantic, I have interests about which I feel passionate, etc. I got here by facing every single demon I had. But there are two people that I simply cannot bring back into my life. When I think about them being gone (from my life, not the world), I used to feel great grief. Now, I recently realized, I feel disappointment. So I've worked my way up the EGS, which is awesome. But I'm still not a match for being back in relationship with these two people. My vibration is one of disappointment, so I continue to experience disappointing situations, in this regard. I know there's no way for me to have these people back in my life until I am a match for how I believe the relationship will make me feel, which is great joy. I'm not a victim of what they want, their "free will" is not overriding my desire...I'm just not yet a vibrational match for the awesome reconnection that is in my vortex.

So my destiny, if you will, is to feel how I really, truly feel. Which is disappointment. At this moment, my destiny is to accept that I'll never ever get to talk to my friends again, but that's OK for it to be this way. That's my vibrational level at the moment. My destiny is not where I'm going. It's where I am. And as I release my resistance, and climb the EGS, my destiny is altered. When I was in grief, I believed I'd never talk to my friends again, but that it was not OK. So my destiny was altered, is altered.

I look forward to when my vibration changes to one of hope and contentment, whenever that happens, whenever I allow that for myself...I'm excited to experience that! :)


answered 14 May '18, 02:18

JMA's gravatar image


perhaps destiny is the
context within which is choice,
does one rely on feelings
of heart or fear


answered 22 May '18, 17:22

fred's gravatar image


I believe that this is a paradox which is actually true: there is destiny (a life theme - See Bashar), which is a number of probable realities we can choose from; and hence, there is choice. This means there are innumerable or infinite paths that we can choose from. (See Bashar and Elan for this).

How do you explain unwanted manifestations? Teal Swan (whom I do not follow much, but this struck me) has explained this by reference (i) to our brain, i.e. what we want; and (ii) what our higher self leads us to, as it is what we need. This is also explained by Bashar. The mistake we often make I think is believing that this is an external force. Just because we are not conscious about the higher self's plan (destiny) does not mean that it is not us creating our life situations. We have decided what our life theme is prior to assuming physicality.

We assume that in this physicality we know what we want based on our logical mind. But how many times have you discovered that your mind was wrong? This is how I explain it to myself. My mind may want something but is it really what I want, i.e. what I need? And here comes the realisation of integration which in turn makes one become more conscious, a more conscious creator. We integrate all of the manifestations occurring in our life through (a) acceptance, (b) acknowledgment, (c) through perceiving the benefit of them (even if we might label them as negative). Even though we are not aware of how they came accepting that we have created them makes us more conscious creators and helps us to gradually remove the barrier of not knowing.

What about our desires? We may say that we have a desire but it has not yet manifested and therefore it is not our destiny to experience this. Again, the mind may be mistaken as to what our true desire is. And this explains our journey towards being more conscious because it is through unravelling what we truly desire leads us to becoming more conscious of us as beings. A true desire that has lingered for long, even though it may have changed in terms of details, will also be realised because the fact that there is a true desire is an indication in itself that it requires realisation. This is where once again consciousness comes in. The more conscious we are of our limiting beliefs about that desire the faster we manifest it. However, even if we have huge barriers of limiting beliefs, your higher self will always lead you to experiences (sometimes very painful) so that you face such beliefs and change them. This may take a lifetime or even more.

We cannot measure what happens only in this lifetime as it is an infinity of experience.

Therefore, the paradox that there is destiny and yet we have free will and choice, in my opinion, holds true. Anyone can argue for either of the sides, but the acceptance that both exist is true integration which leads to further awareness.


answered 14 May '18, 03:05

nbd028's gravatar image


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