This question is marked "community wiki".

I wanted to inform everyone clearly on this point,

It is warned in old writings that using LOA to attract anything, will have to be payed in Karma in this life or in later lifes as suffering and misery.

Please do your own research, don't trust my words.

Interesting link;

asked 16 Dec '12, 13:44

mastermind2's gravatar image


edited 16 Dec '12, 13:50

Barry%20Allen's gravatar image

Barry Allen ♦♦


Great question.. I know you said that devoted l.o.a people need not read lol, BUt unfortunately there are way to many here not to. I hope I wasnt offensive in ur eyes for my answer. It is with GREAT respect and love.

(16 Dec '12, 21:50) TReb Bor yit-NE

It wasn't offensive at all, Rob. Thank you for your answer!

(17 Dec '12, 03:32) mastermind2

@mastermind2 and question back at you, what happens when karma disappears? Since good and bad is matter of perception rather than matter of strict set rules, simply witnessing and observing one's life without taking any side and making any judgement, karma would have to cease to exist as such.

(17 Dec '12, 06:00) CalonLan

For some reason these days when I notice fear-mongering on IQ, I can't help but think of the Bum on the Street analogy and I end up grinning inanely. I'm going to get locked up one day if I keep smiling like this for no reason in public places. Sincere thanks for sharing another marvellously creative way to sit in the dark on a sunny day. I quite enjoyed this one :)

(17 Dec '12, 06:11) Stingray

I'm with you, @Stingray!

(17 Dec '12, 06:23) Bedazzled

@Stingray, neither drug addicts can see the problem the drug they are taking creates. ;)

"In the pursuit of Knowledge, every day something is added. In the practice of the Way, every day something is dropped. Less and less do you need to force things, until finally you arrive at non-action. When nothing is done, nothing is left undone."

I don't have to go far to state the obvious that LOA is always adding. With always something to do and something left undone.

(17 Dec '12, 06:40) CalonLan

And I am not afraid of LOA or Karma. So I ventured in :):)

(17 Dec '12, 07:25) clearheart

@Stingray, @Bedazzled, @clearheart - Me too! Lol! :D

(17 Dec '12, 09:29) Grace

Wow @Stingray "another marvellously creative way to sit in the dark on a sunny day".... this is such a strong sentence, I couldn't have said it any better.

(17 Dec '12, 09:35) MoonWillow

@mastermind2, quite possible, but after enlightenment and during the phase of living in it, there is no good nor bad, so when physical body dies, there is no karma to be transferred to the next life. If there is a next life after that. So assuming possibility of choice to stay in physical circle of existence or abandon it, if one chooses to stay, he would have to,bluntly put, start with 0 points on his karma account?

(17 Dec '12, 09:46) CalonLan

@CalonLan Can I please know where this information about Buddhism come to you?

(17 Dec '12, 09:57) mastermind2

@mastermind2, is there a specific part you are referring to or you asking about the whole of what I said?

(17 Dec '12, 10:14) CalonLan

@mastermind2, as I sat and felt rather detached from the scenery I was looking at.It occurred to me then,that good and bad being matter of perspective do exist in mind and don't exist outside of it. If karma is based on good and bad, then how can it be determined what's good and bad if one moves out of his mind.

I can't tell if giving some $ to a bum is good or bad. It's merely giving some $ to a bum to me. How would it be possible to have a trace of karma of such action. Of all such actions.

(17 Dec '12, 10:35) CalonLan

If I don't distinguish between good or bad. And just as I can't say it whether my act was good or bad, neither can't anyone else. So you see the paradox, if I were to be born again, then what karma I would have ? Technically speaking I would have to have none. Point blank, 0. Because nothing and everything I did, was what it was not what I would think it to be as I don't think my actions to be anything at all.

(17 Dec '12, 10:38) CalonLan

@CalonLan " neither drug addicts can see the problem the drug they are taking creates. ;)"

well i am afraid in most cases... THIS is not true either lol... They are DAMN sure aware of it, but feel to powerless to change it, and they do not care to have a feeling that hurts.. i know why u use the analogy, BUT , not a very good one to use. In this case it is somthing I know allot about, BUT i see ur point and it was a good point to make the connection to it. LOVE

(17 Dec '12, 16:15) TReb Bor yit-NE

@calonlan if you look at a scale can you say if it is going to the right or the left? then how can you say that you do not know? when you will be able to balence that scale then you will know the left and the right and they will become one. but since many on the outside do not see this they have imbalence result. how then can you expect them to be born again? if they are not in truth in them. in non-duality there is no paradox. where you see a paradox a born again only see a puzzle.

(17 Dec '12, 16:38) white tiger

either the puzzle is understand and done properly or it is not done properly and unfinish. how many puzzle in you are done and solved with out ignoring some pieces of the puzzle. are you still in ignorance or are you in truth? also if you where born again there would be no more karma in you. the darkness and ignorance being solved. and seing the big picture of the puzzle in truth. experience and enjoy.

(17 Dec '12, 16:42) white tiger

will also add that right now you see those puzzle as non-related but they relate more then you can see. in the mind and in the heart. until the puzzle is solved division and duality remains.

(17 Dec '12, 16:52) white tiger

@Stingray For now, let's say, "He who laughs last, laughs longest".

(18 Dec '12, 01:33) mastermind2

@mastermind2, if I lose my hand, it's good in relation to having no hands, it's bad in relation to having having both of them. All the judgements makes sense only if there's something to compare them to. Something you set as fundamental rule.

I don't confuse views of religions, more like I mix them all together deliberately. I've no use for boundaries they create within them. To me, concept of karma is true, but at the same time it's total nonsense.

I give in to way of no religion,...

(18 Dec '12, 02:00) CalonLan

...philosophy, understanding, way of nobody. For way of nobody is no way.

And it occurred to me, from intellectual point of view, that if karma can be positive and negative, then it can be also neutral. So I was playing with thoughts of what would happen then.

(18 Dec '12, 02:02) CalonLan

@white tiger, duality pretty much solves itself the moment you stop trying to solve it. When you stop trying to use good to balance bad, or bad to balance good is when you see good and bad was never off balance and no balancing was needed. Bad and good exists together and depend on each other.

(18 Dec '12, 02:10) CalonLan

@white tiger, and how can I know where's right and where is left? If I go where to right, and turn to walk looking in that direction it's no longer right, it's forward and if I turn again I can walk the same direction but it's to left now.

Just like sun never rises in the east and never sets in the west. Is west east or is east west? Not to mention sun actually never sets nor rises anyway. Do you see illusions we create and live by? And then how can you believe anything ? ;)

(18 Dec '12, 02:17) CalonLan

@white tiger, the moment all religions were put into words they became lies. Although they attempt to speak of the truth.

(18 Dec '12, 02:18) CalonLan

@Rob, you are right, "LOA is a drug" would suffice completely. ;-)

(18 Dec '12, 02:22) CalonLan

@mastermind2, free thinker is free in the world of thoughts, ideas, beliefs, perceptions. Although he still may be chained down and locked in a prison in the physical world.

A falling tree will kill me regardless of what I think, but it may not if I notice and jump aside. Just as taxes and el. bills are physical world events to be dealt with by physical world means. Just as yin is balanced by yang and not by lollipops.

(18 Dec '12, 03:09) CalonLan

ha ha ha ha in your delusion if that is what you want. by your answer i know that you do not know much and do not want to learn more. so i will leave it at that,so see you in 2000 year, experience and enjoy.

(18 Dec '12, 04:10) white tiger

@white tiger, yes, I'd like know even less, to unlearn all that I've learned if possible. And then not learn anything ever again. 2000 years seems fine, but forever left in emptiness of not knowing seems better. ;)

(18 Dec '12, 04:13) CalonLan

@CalonLan told me in a previous post that "existence is sadness". I don't know why you would say such a thing, if you don't believe in any other law in the universe than loa.

(18 Dec '12, 10:57) mastermind2

@MasterMind2-Thank you for the warning. This LOA stuff clearly isnt resonating with you. So may I ask you what is motivating you to waste so much time on this site? Thanks.

(18 Dec '12, 10:58) Satori

@Satori I thought time doesn't exist for you guys? Try affirming that ;)

(18 Dec '12, 11:04) mastermind2

@Mastermind2- Ok so you don't want to answer that one. That's cool. I hope you find something that resonates with you. Thanks.

(18 Dec '12, 11:26) Satori

@mastermind2 Yogarudha Siddha Purusha with out fear cross the last door mahasamadhi,yet as free will to stay or to come back. why do disciple see this as the highest achivement? it is only free will,as the holy father as free will.then what is so hard to understand about the word tathagata or i am the ressurection and the life. many are on a wide road stuck in delusion. do not be surprise at my saying.

(18 Dec '12, 19:24) white tiger

@CalonLan LOL,... thank u my friend, great insight lololololol

(18 Dec '12, 19:44) TReb Bor yit-NE

@Stingray - the "laughs last" crack reminded me of your parents. ;) What I want to know is, how could a person like you attract this stuff? Or how did I? Or any of us? It seems so far removed from my reality, except for performing the service of reminding me why I believe as I do, and reinforcing those beliefs tremendously. I would love to know what you think. Thanks! :)

(18 Dec '12, 23:21) Grace

@mastermind2, To every law there is a way to upend it. LOA is no exception. It's just too big and underlies so many things people usually out of their smallness refuse to imagine such ways. Just like they say the universe is infinite, only because they can't see to the end of it.

(19 Dec '12, 04:07) CalonLan

@Grace - Funnily enough, I've just been visiting my parents for the past few days so missed all of this fun :) I notice we've had a few questions on IQ recently about clattering and now the site has manifested a couple of very clear examples of public clattering within a few days of each other. (Notice how the attention-grabbing "noise" increases dramatically before separation). Just a thought for you. Anyway, got to get back to my end-of-the-world bunker :)

(19 Dec '12, 04:37) Stingray
showing 1 of 37 show 36 more comments

No matter what we believe, there are often consequences to actions. So if I practice the do unto others motto then I will attract good. Everyday I practice not hurting others or myself. I practice attracting good and mostly that only happens when I'm vibrating in peace,love and joy. If I love others as myself then my karma will be good and leave behind good. There are times I have wanted to lash out, however with the study of LOA I'm learning to handle things in a kinder gentler way because that is how I want to be treated.

As far as the things I want such as abundance,wellbeing, feeling good. From here I am able to give more also and that feels good to me.

I love the discussions on IQ :)


answered 17 Dec '12, 04:58

clearheart's gravatar image


edited 17 Dec '12, 05:00


It is fun to get picked :) :) ,thankyou.

(17 Dec '12, 09:48) clearheart

@clearheart.. get used to it lol,. with insight such as urs it will not be the last time u "get picked" lol. love

(17 Dec '12, 16:11) TReb Bor yit-NE

I don't know when people are going to understand that the
law of attraction does not mean the law of positive attraction
and that karma does not mean negative cause and effect.

Law of attraction is just as non-judgemental as to the nature of its attraction
as karma is to the nature of its consequential "effect".

Perhaps the entire problem is rooted in the fact that we tend to be only interested in "positive" thinking and then apply the opinions from that curiosity towards our comprehension of LOA and Karma.

If we begin from the blank slate of inner silence and then build our understanding of THINKING from our own experience of experimentation, we will find that most of the opinions on this phenomenon are nothing more than just conversations for the pleasure of sharing and belonging to a group.

The Law of attraction is neither positive nor negative.

Likewise, Karma is not an explanation of negative cause and effect.

If one insists that it is so, then they are yet to understand the non-judgemental nature of FOCUS and attraction.


answered 17 Dec '12, 11:48

The%20Traveller's gravatar image

The Traveller

edited 17 Dec '12, 11:52

Ok, but using Law of attraction is almost the exact same as Karma... And when we look deeply into it, it is only that Karma has more beliefs to it. Treb describes Karma (in past live or lives ) to bleed troughs of realities, and when we feel them, acknowledge them and believe it is Karma. that is all it is, a belief system of having to right the wrongs. A Bleed through happens because of our similarities with the past lives. If you accept it, it becomes more real. Using Law of attraction is default... Karma is a belief system that is a religions version of it. Nothing more, nothing less. It is only a more limiting version of it. BECAUSE it has rules regulations, and ideals that say it must. Here is somthing to me that shows that it is a valid ideas that i shared. It is an expert from Seth Speaks - The Eternal Validity of the Soul - Jane Roberts.

"Quite simply, a belief in the good without a belief in the evil, may seem highly unrealistic to you. This belief, however, is the best kind of insurance that you can have, both during physical life and afterward.

It may outrage your intellect, and the evidence of your physical senses may shout that it is untrue, yet a belief in good without a belief in evil is actually highly realistic, since in physical life it will keep your body healthier, keep you psychologically free of many fears and mental difficulties, and bring you a feeling of ease and spontaneity in which the development of your abilities can be better fulfilled. After death it will release you from the belief in demons and hell, and enforced punishment. You will be better prepared to understand the nature of reality as it is. I understand that the concept does indeed offend your intellect, and that your senses seem to deny it. Yet you should already realize that your senses tell you many things, which are not true; and I tell you that your physical senses perceive a reality that is a result of your beliefs. Believing in evils, you will of course perceive them. Your world has not tried the experiment as yet which would release you. Christianity was but a distortion of this main truth - that is, organized Christianity as you know it. I am not simply speaking here of the original precepts. They were hardly given a chance, and we will discuss some of this later in the book.

The experiment that would transform your world would operate upon the basic idea that you create your own reality according to the nature of your beliefs, and that all existence was blessed, and that evil did not exist in it. If these ideas were followed individually and collectively, then the evidence of your physical senses would find no contradiction. They would perceive the world and existence as good.

This is the experiment that has not been tried, and these are the truths that you must learn after physical death. Some, after death, understanding these truths, choose to return to physical existence and explain them. Through the centuries this has been the way. In the system of probabilities that originates within physical reality, this is also the case."

Love and light.



answered 16 Dec '12, 17:03

TReb%20Bor%20yit-NE's gravatar image

TReb Bor yit-NE

edited 16 Dec '12, 17:09

@Rob, It's not an uncommon event to believe one side and completely deny the opposite one. If you look throughout history of men kind, you will find it repeated many times. That is why absolute faith is blind.

But by nature of things, as can be observed all around, we know that even if good becomes predominant, possibility for birth of evil will never perish.

So good would exists based on certain beliefs, and any change to those beliefs would result in altering end result of goodness.

(17 Dec '12, 01:48) CalonLan

@CalonLan Great point brother, it is all views either way isnt it? good evil? are not these just our own perceptions my brother? I love conversing with u, u help mirror myself back to me so well. LOVE..

(17 Dec '12, 16:10) TReb Bor yit-NE

rob anny way they cannot accept it. they have not cross that door. and they do not believe anny one that crossed that door. they prefer to make religion or to not have help their ego.and praise one jesus said if you do not believe me when i speak of earthly things how will you ever believe me if i tell you of heavenly is their free will and they are responsible of it so let them have it.

(18 Dec '12, 04:23) white tiger

@Rob are they ours or are they their own and we merely side with them as we please in search for meaning, reason and identity? But the thing I contemplate is how few people can sit in silence and even less can stand the emptiness of being.

Like empty jars we strive to fill ourselves, yet were we to fill ourselves with emptiness, we'd prolly go crazy. And then word of men give everyone possibility to hear what they want.

(18 Dec '12, 04:45) CalonLan

@white tiger ... i understand what u mean, BUT it is all about the choice, and as a person who speaks highly of free will, i try not to be upset or become frustrated with those who choose a path that is different from my own, thank u for ur comment.

(18 Dec '12, 07:53) TReb Bor yit-NE

@CalonLan .. yes, i do understand what u mean, it is very important for us to feel full, some do in different ways, and as long as these ways are helpful in showing one themselves, then i agree, i do not condone, nor condemn any idea that makes a man a better man.. LOVE..

(18 Dec '12, 07:54) TReb Bor yit-NE
showing 2 of 6 show 4 more comments

I think many people using LOA are already paying for it. It's sweet like sugar, and unhealthy just as well. It's hard to let go, because good vibrations, good deeds and good feelings taste so good.

Just look at that despair for goodness. All the issues and problems people get caught up in creating sadness in their lives and the desperate need to balance it. LOA seem to be a one way ticket to happiness. And so one will dive into it, pick up and try any technique only to feel good... must look through all that's done to see the reason why it's done. It's individual and it's a counter measure. A balancing act. Just like yin and yang. Engraved within the very nature of ourselves and everything around us.

Using LOA keeps you in yang most the time. Because it provides you with fulfillment.

Fulfillment of what? Emptiness.

With every act of desire and manifestation of things you create another attachment. And the more you create of it further from the middle point of balance you get. It is attachment that creates suffering.

But while you chew on that sugar and taste its sweet flavor, you're oblivious to its consequences. And it may take very long time to realize. With LOA, maybe a lifetime or more.


answered 17 Dec '12, 02:05

CalonLan's gravatar image


edited 17 Dec '12, 02:23

is it not strange that you give answer and contradict your self when you talk with me.and how can I know where's right and where is left? If I go where to right, and turn to walk looking in that direction it's no longer right, it's forward and if I turn again I can walk the same direction but it's to left now. you are happy contradicting people but you contradict your are entertaing.i think you have reach your boundary.ha ha ha ha.

(18 Dec '12, 04:30) white tiger

@white tiger,behold! I'm walking contradiction.You are right,I don't only proclaim white.I have as pitch black within me as whitey white.And all the shades of grey they create combined together.

I could write a book and then turn around and write another that opposes the first one.There's no reason to take sides.I feel no need to have MY opinion.Why own anything. I came here empty handed, I'll go empty handed. I may just as well live like that.

Here one opinion, there opposite one. Beautiful.

(18 Dec '12, 09:05) CalonLan

Hey @CalonLan :) I'm curious about something... are you saying a person should not try to feel better about things, or look for reasons to feel better?

(18 Dec '12, 13:08) LapisLazuli

Hey @LapisLazuli, when u're sad, you try to feel good. But I ask, why? Why the need to run from sadness towards happiness all the time. When you stop running and look at life, you see that sadness co-exist with happiness in harmony. When summer pass and winter come, do u go running to place full of summer, or do u enjoy snow, skiing, and all of that which winter brings? Whn you live the current season, you dont run, your every action becomes complete. And you will enjoy sadness and happiness.

(18 Dec '12, 14:25) CalonLan

@lapisLazuli, when u find the balance, in emptiness, where no there is no meaning, no reason, no thoughts, no I, nothing. You will look at sadness, have tears rolling down your face but inside you will not move. Whn you look at happiness, you will have smile on your face, but inside you will not move. Not haunt by anything, fear disappers freedom appears. And you may enjoy whole existence without limitations that ur mind used to throw infront of u.

(18 Dec '12, 14:37) CalonLan

Thank you :) That was very clear

(18 Dec '12, 14:45) LapisLazuli

@calonlan that is exactely what i am telling you. if you contradict your self you are not in balence yet. you only think that you are. if you are walking contradictionand are empty and want to remain empty, you are lost by your own free will.then you cannot accept anny one that is not empty.and that bring something.because it is waking you up from your own slumber that you have fallen in. your mind does not throw limitation infront of are the one painting them as such. ha ha ha ha

(18 Dec '12, 15:42) white tiger

Yes @white tiger, people are searching for fulfillment, I seek emptiness. hi hi hi

(19 Dec '12, 03:43) CalonLan

@calonlan “Shape clay into a vessel;
 It is the space within that makes it useful. 
Cut doors and windows for a room;
 It is the holes which make it useful. 
Therefore benefit comes from what is there; 
Usefulness from what is not there.” you are still under the water day you will reach the surface and one day you will see the sun. but for now you need to find your balence and come out of your contradiction. smile.

(19 Dec '12, 23:11) white tiger

@white tiger, but of course, I'm a dream of existence as I exist in non-existence. An emptiness surrounded by walls of emptiness.

If low vibration is a stone and high vibration is water. I step out of the game of vibrations to become no vibration, in nothingness I become something as I fill the emptiness to its fullest.

(20 Dec '12, 02:23) CalonLan
showing 2 of 10 show 8 more comments

Let's look at it this way -

Maybe I/we all here on InwardQuest have some good Karma queued up in the Universe, and that good Karma has brought us to the knowledge of LOA. The knowledge of how to use it to find ourselves and enjoy the journey we came forth to experience.

After all, we are all God's work and creation and it is only God who could have brought us to Law of Attraction... where else could it have come from?

We all opened ourselves to "answers" and the answers came in this form... just my take on it.


answered 17 Dec '12, 14:54

MoonWillow's gravatar image


attracting anny thing is it good? is it helping you and people around you? you reap what you sow,after all.and some reap what you sow. in a field that they have not work in and sow.also did you have good water to sow? did you reap and gather the crops.did you profit from it? do not be surprise at my saying that if you do not understand and see only the outside and do not see the inside that you will have weird result. if a man came to you and offer you to plant something saying this is what you should eat from because i tell you the truth and it is good for you plant this seed,but if you believe that you should eat from the other plant and plant that seed then you shall die,and you do not trust in what he say then you shall surely die.


answered 16 Dec '12, 16:55

white%20tiger's gravatar image

white tiger

edited 16 Dec '12, 17:06

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