Many people believe that you as a person create your own destiny, you have the power to do so. But what if reality was you are just living out what has already been "planned" for you? You may THINK you are creating your own destiny, but reality wise you are just living out what has already been planned for you. every move you make, every step you take, every breath you inhale, anything that you can even imagine ALL part of the "plan" aka your destiny. Thoughts please??


asked 27 Feb '10, 06:14

Mebb's gravatar image


edited 27 Feb '10, 07:27

Vesuvius's gravatar image


Could it be that free will and destiny are counterparts of each other?

What if in this duality universe, these two concepts influence each other the most, therefore making them the counterparts.

Let's say that you are in a line up in the bank. You, deciding to exercise your free will, suddenly shout "I Have a Gun, I Have a Gun". In that instant moment you just changed your destiny. For what is likely to come next is largely un-avoidable by you.

But within the outcome that is born out of this action, a new set of circumstances of free will are available.

What if in our day-to-day existence conditions that constantly come up are not so dramatically obvious as this but nevertheless, are products of this constantly fluctuating counterparts of free will & destiny


answered 27 Feb '10, 18:17

The%20Traveller's gravatar image

The Traveller

ahha agreed. great answer traveller. vote up and check^^)

(27 Feb '10, 18:28) Mebb

Thanks Mebb! Your comments definitely help me trust my inspiration.

(28 Feb '10, 01:43) The Traveller

The word destiny by definition means "predetermined." As usual, when someone asks a question that appears on its face to have an obvious answer, I did a little research, and came across an idea I hadn't initially thought of.

Our path through life is governed by the choices we make. The ability to make a choice at any given moment is called "free will." The act of making that choice can be called, "exercising your free will." But once that choice is made, it limits any future choices you may make, and therefore constrains the future path your life can take.

Let us take an example. Say, you are going to plant a tree. As long as you have not done it, you have plenty of options. You may choose not to plant the seed at all. You may choose the type of tree you wish to grow. But once you have taken that decision and acted upon it, your freedom is curtailed by many degrees. If you plant a mango tree, then no matter what you do you cannot get lemons or any other fruit from that tree. You can only get mangoes. If you wish to get any fruit at all from the tree, you must water it and fertilize it, and do the things that knowledge tells you will keep the tree healthy enough to bear fruit.

In other words, if you want a certain outcome, you are bound by the requirements of the process that produces that desired outcome. Your actions are, therefore, predetermined.


answered 27 Feb '10, 06:43

Vesuvius's gravatar image


Aaah ... ultimately, this is ye age olde debate of free will vs determinism (= a destiny carved in stone) again.

We have learnt that when John says (A) that all cars a red, and Frank states (B) that all cars are blue, and both seem to be correct in arguing their position, time will show that the real answer is (C), in that it unifies both points of view into one: that all cars in their special world are violet. Both were correct but they couldn't see the whole picture yet at that time as long as the color violet had not been discovered. This is what Hegel's Thesis, Antithesis, Synthesis triad means.

I believe that of all philosophical issues however, this free will vs determinism thing will be one of the last that can be resolved.

Science point of view

Most conventional scientists and physicists of today argue for determinism, because what motivates them at last is the quest to find a formula for everything that is yet inexplicable. If a true Universal Formula For Everything can be found, then there will be no place for free will. We basically live a billard ball or giant clockwork universe where everything can be precalculated if the position and impulse of every single particle that exists is known at a given time. (Quantum theory is surely still in for the occasional weirdness but they're trying to get that in control.)

And yes, that goes also for the particles in our brains, because basically we are merely biological machines, Neuronal Networks pre-determined by our genes and by the influences of our surroundings. The concept of a soul is denied, it does not exist, and free will is an illusion, because every decision that we make is the result of a long, long chain of cause and effect. Yes, even if we try to do something extraordinarily unusual and crazy just to test this, an observer from outside with a powerful computer will be able to tell us that he saw that coming. The only reason why this doesn't happen is because computers are not powerful enough (and fortunately won't be for a very long time) to collect and calculate all the information needed.

It's interesting to note that this is what rational thinking really means when thinking it out to the final conclusion. If somebody, sometime, somewhere in the whole universe is able to make just one little decision of true free will, then the universe will collapse. ;-)

Spiritualistic approach

There is of course also the concept of determinism in religion, as in imagining a God who pre-planned everything meticulously. This is basically a belief thing, discussing this would be tiresome and lead to nowhere. :->

Apparently, some idealistic, scientific minds a few hundreds of years ago wanted to break with those superstitious beliefs and explain us the real nature of things with common sense and reason in an Age of Enlightenment.

Ironically, they inevitably came to the same conclusion, see above. ;-)

As said, if only one little spark of free will is possible, then it is only a matter of degree of how much we are able to change our individual destinies.

I believe we create the universe as we go. We are fractions of God and not a separate thing. The droplets are not separate from the ocean, but also, and it might sound blasphemic for some, the ocean would not exist without the droplets. All our thoughts and actions are God's own thoughts and actions. This will go on until every possible thought has been thought, every dream has been dreamed, every angle has been explored and every reality has been manifested. It will go until the concept of existence is fulfilled and is discovered in every possible aspect, when-ever that may be, if-ever that is possible.


answered 27 Feb '10, 14:02

herzmeister's gravatar image


edited 27 Feb '10, 19:46

Science believed that the universe was deterministic until about 1960, when Edward Lorentz began simulating weather patterns in a computer. After that, the discovery of chaotic systems, and phenomena such as turbulence, the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle and the Butterfly Effect, pretty much proved the existence of things that are inherently unpredictable.

(27 Feb '10, 16:00) Vesuvius

Chaos theory is fascinating because dynamic systems form certain patterns and not just "white noise". Opposite to the classical approach of breaking things down into parts or models in order to be able to analyze them separately so that the underlying law of nature can be found, chaos theory is motivated by the fact that such "black boxes" do not exist in nature/real life, as everything interacts with each other, and everything is interconnected. This makes equations utterly complex with way too many unknowns.

(27 Feb '10, 19:43) herzmeister

Chaos theory therefore uses a statistical or stochastical approach. But the underlying mechanisms still might very well be deterministic. This whole subject is discussed at - "“Predictability” is therefore a façon de parler that at best makes vivid what is at stake in determinism; in rigorous discussions it should be eschewed. The world could be highly predictable, in some senses, and yet not deterministic; and it could be deterministic yet highly unpredictable, as many studies of chaos (sensitive dependence on initial conditions) show."

(27 Feb '10, 19:44) herzmeister

New Science. Scientists need to update their information. We have moved way beyond Newtonian physics... It is a faulty assumption that we are controlled by our genes. It is not possible for a gene to activate or change on its own. It is the environmental signal and our perception (belief) that contributes to a change in our system. According to Dr. Bruce Lipton. Great stuff :-)

(28 Feb '10, 02:51) Eddie

@Eddie, yes i'm aware of Dr. Bruce Lipton, and I also feel he's right with many things, but I'm afraid he's still "too out there" for conventional science community: :-> ... Nevertheless, to come back to the OP: Even if we can influence our genes, it won't solve the question of determinism, as our desire to do so may solely come from our environment and not from "within".

(28 Feb '10, 09:39) herzmeister
showing 2 of 5 show 3 more comments

Your destiny is determined by your choices.

The journey is pre-determined (by prior mutual arrangement ;) ) but the destination is determined by the free choices you make on a daily basis.

You will travel! Where to is up to you.


answered 01 Mar '10, 22:48

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