I have been re-reading this post: How did Esther meet Abraham and what are the characteristics of channelling?, and Stingray's reply to it. His "Guidelines for discernment when channelling" rings really true and it made a lot to clarify things for me. But I got concerned by answers like this one, and this other one to the question 'Is the “New Age” movement a fad, or a real quest towards a new spirituality?'. People seem to be scared out of their wits with this 'demon' thing they keep talking about.
Here's my question: Why people is cautioned against using the Ouija Board as it might atract evil or michievous spirits, while 'Channelling' is OK and seem to attract generous and good spirits/masters?. Any input will be wellcomed.
asked 08 Jul '10, 14:41
Regarding Ouija Board vs Channelling, Abraham have said in the past that the Ouija Board is viewed as a frivolous activity and therefore attracts consciousnesses in harmony with that.
It's about the intent you approach it with. I would say that if you were to approach the use of the Ouija Board with a much more serious intent (rather than a party game), it would attract a different matching consciousness. But I think the intrinsic game-based feel of using the Ouija Board probably makes that difficult.
Let me address this fear of demons thing here because it has surfaced a few times on this website and the spreading of this fear has been one of the most surprising aspects for me of taking part here.
As I've mentioned before, I think the folks who propose these ideas do so with the best of intents (in seeking to prevent harm to others) and I mean no disrespect to any of them but I think they are overlooking an important point in what they propose.
An example may make my point clear...
Let us assume we have a manipulative, evil demon (whatever that means to you), and this evil demon is out to influence you to, say, throw yourself off a cliff and kill yourself for whatever evil kicks the demon gets from doing that. Seems like a pretty evil thing to make someone do, don't you think? :)
And let us assume that this demon is so clever and smooth-talking at pretending to be good that it has gained your trust and you follow closely what it says.
Let us say that the steps involved in throwing yourself off a cliff (to your death) are as follows...
Now let me assume that I am the one that the demon is trying to trick...
See my point?
At some step along the way to you being manipulated to something that doesn't serve you, you are going to have a negative emotional response.
In other words, there will always come a time when following the demon's advice is not going to feel good.
And, if you make it your number one priority in life to always seek out things that make you feel good (as I've been saying on this website for many months), you are never going to comply.
It doesn't matter how subtle are the steps in persuading you to do something that doesn't serve you, there will come a time when feeling good will turn to feeling bad and that's when you will naturally STOP following the advice.
So Feeling Good, as well as manifesting everything you want in life, also protects you from evil demons. Cool, huh? :)
answered 08 Jul '10, 15:37
Excellent, yes! Really cool answer! :D But, with your permission, let me play 'Devil's Advocate' here: (Yes, I am this kind of person :P) Let's go back to point 4. We are asuming you have been talking to this demon for quite a while and anything he promised you you would get you did. And now he says: Go right to the cliff edge. I'll teach you how to fly. I have never lied to you, have I? What would you think before he orders you Throw yourself off the cliff? Would you be nervous then or trustful?
(08 Jul '10, 15:53) BridgetJones09
@Bridget - It's true that in my ridiculous contrived example it seems like there might be a possibility that the demon might still trick you. But, in reality, this can't happen. This is because you are not just a physical consciousness. You are made up of two parts - a physical side and a non-physical side, often termed Higher Self, Inner Being, Master Within or whatever. Together, they make up You. The Higher Self aspect of you operates at the same level of the (non-existent) demon so you would be well aware of the deceit before you got anywhere near the cliff edge :)
(08 Jul '10, 17:41) Stingray
That works if the demon has no impact on your emotions, I remember reading 30 Years Among The Dead. Picture instead on a demon someone very depressed decided to move in with you, you have no contact because you do not even realize it. This deep depression is around you it is strong because it is so negative now it is attracting into your life more depression. So you start feeling this is your own depression it gets so bad you just want to kill yourself to end it all. This is much more close to how possession works it is influence not manipulation.
(09 Jul '10, 06:03) Wade Casaldi
@Stingray: You know your example it's neither ridiculous nor badly contrived. :) I just thought if I were the demon I would be saying that to you. But I think that, as a demon, I should 'trudge back to Evil School for more training' as you put it. lol Your answer really took some weight off my mind! Thank you!
(09 Jul '10, 15:32) BridgetJones09
@Wade- Once you no longer make it your priority in life to feel good, all bets are off, and basically anything can happen to you including being influenced negatively by others. You are like a small boat cast adrift on the rough sea left to the mercy of the waves and tides. But the situation you are talking about could only occur if, firstly, someone was already in the vicinity of depression, otherwise the Law of Attraction would not match you up and, secondly, if someone had numbed themselves to how they feel. All change is accompanied by an emotional response but many people ignore it
(09 Jul '10, 19:03) Stingray
@Bridget - I'm glad you're feeling better about this subject. There really is nothing to fear in life, ever.
(09 Jul '10, 19:56) Stingray
You are assuming that the demons wish is for you to die, suppose for the sake of argument that it only wants you to not see the opportunity that will make you happy and content leading you into a state of eternal bliss. It can be something that subtle and simply a matter of misdirection. You are doing a great job of misdirecting others yourself. Everything isn't always Black and White, it is a sea of gray. Are you a DEMON stingray?
(10 Jul '10, 01:14) Goodisevil
Right that is what I mean if yo, lets say for example approach the ouji board in a state of depression because you are seeking an answer tell you maybe there is some hope. That is going to attract something negative so instead of feeling better you feel worse. It is called giving the devil a foot hold in the bible, so we must at all times keep on the armor of God. You do that by always choosing to feel good, it is the same as always knowing you are safe and protected.
(10 Jul '10, 01:20) Wade Casaldi
Perfect, thank you.
(31 May '11, 22:30) you
This gives new meaning to the line uttered by Obi-Wan's spirit during the final run in the Death Star trench at the end of Star Wars: "Luke, trust your feelings!"
(04 May '14, 12:28) lozenge123
showing 2 of 10 show 8 more comments
I am so glad that I read this question after the answers from Stingray, Drham, and Wade Casaldi were already posted here.
Simply put, I trust the inner self...end of story!
I discovered that one does not have to take a stand on one side of the internal structure of one's own belief system and actively reject of fight against the existence of contradiction within the same consciousness.
In other words, Ideas that support the great information from Abraham, and Seth and Ideas that seem to caution against them can both coexist within my consciousness without one having to defeat the other.
Maybe it's because when I make a decision on something I don't think it, I feel it instead. So there is no analysis involved to decide what is right or wrong. It is usually "how does this feel at this moment?"
Stingray's excellent answer in many ways reflects this very same approach.
answered 10 Jul '10, 06:27
Thanks for emphasizing this point, Traveller. You can take any body of knowledge, and using your emotions, filter out what is valuable for you and leave the rest. While I agree with everything that Abraham has said up to now (mostly through continual testing in my own life), I have problems with Bashar when he starts talking about subjects like alien abductions, so I just let those bits go (for now). One day, I might meet an ET (assuming it isn't me! http://www.inwardquest.com/questions/1867/are-you-an-et-a-wanderer/1869#1869 ) and then my views may change :)
(10 Jul '10, 08:54) Stingray
I'm totally with you on this. When we listen to our own inner guidance, we can't go wrong and we become more open to other possibilities. I heard a zen teacher say that we're only STUCK at our current point of understanding. I thought it was a great point to remember for both myself and when I feel like disagreeing with others. It kind of fits in with what you were asking about getting to 'nonbelief' - when we begin to doubt what we believe and realize that we're just stuck, we begin to become unstuck.
(10 Jul '10, 12:29) Michaela
@The Traveller: Sorry if the mention of your name in my post upset you. When @Stingray says 'As I've mentioned before, I think the folks who propose these ideas do so with the best of intents (in seeking to prevent harm to others) and I mean no disrespect to any of them but I think they are overlooking an important point in what they propose.' I realized that I sounded as if I was accusing you. Not in the least. I shuld have posted the links only, not the names, so I am going to edit it. About the rest of your answer, I totally agree with you, I have books in my shelves that seem to
(10 Jul '10, 14:12) BridgetJones09
contradict one another. I take what sounds like truth to me and leave the rest. Even though contradictory, I am proud of my bookshelf. :) So if I upset you in any way, please accept my appology. :)
(10 Jul '10, 14:15) BridgetJones09
Hi BridgetJones09. You didn't upset me in the least bit. If it did I would examine my self as to why. Some of the answers I post here are on the edge of creating an uncomfortable reaction and I am aware of that. But that is the answer that comes to me and I try hard to not sensor it out of concern for the reaction it may create. Likewise I am completely comfortable with how you asked this question, and you didn't have to edit my name. You can put it back if you want, Believe me, it's OK. We are all family here.
(10 Jul '10, 14:35) The Traveller
+1 for generosity!
(13 Jul '10, 15:20) BridgetJones09
showing 2 of 6 show 4 more comments
Channeling is possible in any domain whether you're a scientist searching using a microscope for a new chemical formula, a journalist using a keyboard to write an article or a business man searching for a yes/no answer to a risky project using a ouija board.
Both ouija boards and channeling can provide what you perceive as erroneous material, using a ouija board is channeling using an instrument, channeling is using your body as an instrument, it's not so much the object that is used (the microscope, keyboard, ouija board, your own physical body, pendulum, etc ...), they always transmit their natural true vibrations, it's rather a question of how clear you are within yourself, you are the operator and automatically imbue the object you are using with your natural and learned characteristic patterns of vibrations and thought intentions whether that object be the ouija board or your body. Your opinions (beliefs) can unconsciously intrude and deviate so to speak the truth. That's why it's very important to ground and clear yourself and purify the environment within which you are working before doing this kind of work.
An untrained psychic can be harmful not only to himself but to others around him, it can be compared to someone trying to learn to drive using a single seat formula one racing car, they'd probably end up spinning off track. It's a scary domain to investigate when you don't have the experience and know how of what's happening and why, it's so easy to get caught up in the astral tides of those around you and be bombarded with incomprehensible energies often labeled demons, evil ...
Channeling is stepping aside and translating vibrations, i like to think of these vibrations as bubble shaped holograms, first they give a global impression then when you dig deeper they give more and more detailed information, you always remain in control and conscious of what you are doing. Trance channeling is only for very experienced real masters. In trance channeling you allow certain parts of your body to be animated by finer energies, there's a very fragile line between being an expert trance channeler and being possessed by a block of vibrational energies. 90% of the information translated by a novice is erroneous so it's important to learn how to sort the wheat from the chaff.
It's a normal process for all humans to become channels, though this process can take a very long time, doing any occupation singing, dancing ... but especially occult training such as psychotherapy, meditation, martial arts, tarot, magic, divination, astrology, etc ... can greatly reduce the time it takes. Everyone is psychic though many people are not yet conscious of it.
We all have a psychic sense that mirrors each of our senses;
seeing(clairvoyance) touch/feeling(clairsentience), hearing/listening(clairaudience), smelling(clairalience), tasting(clairgustance), knowing(claircognizance) and we have a few more telepathy, magnetism, hypnotism ...
These are your basic tools and there's a natural progression. When you use and develop all these basic skills, and there are many ways you can bring them into play through everyday tasks like counselling, teaching, intuition, studying ... when they are all working fully together with your intellect there comes a time when you feel that there's a piece missing, that there's some "thing" not quite right. The natural progression is that instead of reaching outwards (horizontal physical energies) you reach inwards and upwards (vertical spiritual energy) at this point a channel of energy rises upwards, energy above reaches downwards and you connect with your "higher self", you become conscious of the existence your higher self, you become conscious of the channel that was always there, you become whole
answered 24 Apr '14, 05:14
I am a channeler and I am an avid user of the Ouija board, this is an issue with both ! SPIRIT CAN LIE! The issue that everyone is cautious with the Ouija is because people who have no idea of the proper use of the boards or how to communicate with spirit get on there, and it is very uncommon but you can get some really nasty spirits. If you do not use the board right or know how to discern the difference from entities that are good or bad, you are "playing with fire" this is the issue. I do understand alot of this is a belief issue, I truly KNOW that when I use the board I never allow the negative entities in my area, this is my space that I have claimed so this is helpful to me. As 4 channeling it's WAY different, you are not just talking to spirit, you are connected to it! I learn from this entity I channel, also if you look at the Seth Speaks, the Eternal Validity of the Soul book by Jane Roberts, you will see that this was her first contact with Seth as well, through the Ouija, so it is simply a tool to communicate with spirit BECAUSE we believe we can!
love n light,
answered 15 May '11, 12:32
TReb Bor yit-NE
Generally when someone decides to turn to the occult, that person is not in a good place, it is someone that feels he or she needs help. Because of this the person is not feeling good the person is in a negative place. Now when the doors to the other side are opened there is no filter as to what you are going to get but where you are at in emotions.
Sometimes the Ouija board is just used for fun but when it starts working everyone fears this, now again in this situation there is a lot of negativity so this attracts more negative.
This holds the same tarot cards, fortune tellers, scrying, anything that you will contact with either fear or worry of desperation you would be pulling toward you things that match these mind waves being transmitted.
A good way to compare this is to our dreams, we walk into an empty house, we do not know where we are so we are walking through this house and then we start walking down some stairs and starting to "wonder should I be here" "What if this is a trap!" "What if when I reach the bottom there is the devil!" We reach the bottom and there it is a devil waiting to get us, isn't that what we just expected?
Our fears pull to us what we fear, so while most fear what they do not understand this makes the ouija board a very negative occult tool, but used by someone that is in the proper place maybe even saying prayers for only the highest good and understanding, this would attract something much more close to those thought waves. In other words fire can be a good thing it can cook your food, fire can also be a bad thing it can kill you, depending on if you know what you are doing with it.
When someone goes to get channeled they are going with a different expectation, to talk with their loved ones or some higher guide so the expectation is different. Now if the person goes with worry or fear the same thing can happen.
answered 10 Jul '10, 03:48
I dissent with you in one point. There is nothing 'occult' in tarot cards. Please read this question of mine and the comments for clarification: http://www.inwardquest.com/questions/6249/has-divination-a-place-in-the-loa-belief-system
(10 Jul '10, 14:59) BridgetJones09
Occult means hidden for one thing, second thing is the cards trace the tree of life path, third thing these people and organization highly valued the tarot, Alister Crowly, A.E. Waite, Madam HP Blavatsky, The Rosicrucians, The Golden Dawn, some of them pretty dark others good.
(11 Jul '10, 05:06) Wade Casaldi
@Wade: Don't worry. I am not a very impressionable person. I take all this as a hobby actually. Half an hour after reading the cards for me, I forget all about it :P I don't give up my free will. NEVER. And as Liam pointed out in the link I sent you, 'You cannot (deliberately and consciously) overcome resistance unless you first acknowledge where it is. Divination can be an aid to that. Whether it is through observation of feelings, tossing runes into the air, poking holes into sand or a laying out of tarot cards - doesn't matter.'
(17 Jul '10, 15:36) BridgetJones09
I am glad we understand each other more clearly now. Talking in these things can get confusing because in a direct conversation things are cleared up as soon as they are there. But we do our best here. :-D
(18 Jul '10, 08:11) Wade Casaldi
I am sure we do our best! Also glad we understand each other. That's the good thing of this site isn't it? ;)
(19 Jul '10, 12:44) BridgetJones09
showing 2 of 5 show 3 more comments
Hi Bridget, I believe that you can connect with the Universe through any means that you desire and you will get a respone. You do not need a Ouija Board, you can use a pen and paper and just ask the questions or you can ask the question and the universe will choose some form to respnsd to you. The Ouija Board to me is no majic. Someone just used a very simple universal principle and capitalized on it. Like Abraham says "you ask and it is given".
answered 08 Jul '10, 23:57
Hi Drham. I would never use a Ouija Board. I am a bit of a wimp for that. I was just curious why one thing was frowned upon and the other was right. I trust the Universe, I do! Thanks for your kind words. :)
(09 Jul '10, 15:35) BridgetJones09
A Ouija Board is just a telephone, but instead of talking to a living person you're talking to a dead one. Is a telephone evil if you call up a crazy person and they say something scary? No, just simply acknowledge that you called the wrong person and hang up.
Instead of pressing numbers, you call up the spirit with your intention. Understand that they area not physical so they can't really hurt you and you have your angels and guidance protecting you through this anyway, if something were to happen.
There is no reason to fear, and if you have an extreme fear then, you probably shouldn't be doing it yet, until you work on trusting that Source and its angels are protecting you.
answered 03 May '14, 20:48
@arpgme yes it's true that the ouija board is often associated with contacting the dead, however just as the pendulum it can be used to explore the whole domain of the invisible world. Ouija boarding is channeling using the board as the physical visual means by which the channeled information is made understandable. With expert channelers like treb the physical means by which information is made understandable is sound, the voice box replaces the ouija board
(04 May '14, 01:45) jaz
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